Episode 179 pic of Dr. Liz Lasky

Dive into the entrepreneurial journey with Amber Hawley and Dr. Liz Lasky’s insightful conversation about leveraging personal growth, learning from diverse coaching experiences, and understanding the importance of selling in business. They demystify the entrepreneurial mindset, discuss the risks and rewards of business ownership, and stress the importance of forward motion in entrepreneurship.

In this episode, you will learn about:

  • Embracing different learning methods and the benefits of coaching for personal and professional development.
  • The significance of pushing your comfort zones and staying open to being wrong for growth.
  • Crafting a clear, specific signature offer to effectively market your profession.
  • The emotional and strategic aspects of business decision-making and growth.
  • Learning how to sell and monetize your business effectively without overcomplicating operations.
  • Sign up for the 2024 Therapist Summit happening March 25th – April 5th

About Dr. Liz Lasky

Dr. Liz Lasky, PhD, LCSW, is the founder and CEO of The Lasky Institute of Coaching™, The Coach Training Program For Helping Professionals™ and lizlasky.com. She has a commitment to helping people get what they want in business, life, and love. She is the author the book “Get What You Want”© 

You can learn more on Liz’s website, follow her on Instagram, and connect with her on LinkedIn.

Links & Resources:

Key Moments In This Episode:

00:00 Welcome to the Easily Distracted Entrepreneur

00:39 Introducing Dr. Liz Laskey and the Power of Summits

03:40 The Essence of Entrepreneurship vs. Business Ownership

07:50 Personal Journeys and Entrepreneurial Intelligence

18:09 Embracing the Entrepreneurial Spirit and Overcoming Challenges

23:03 The Importance of Motion in Business and Life

26:30 Balancing the Scales: The Who and the What in Coaching

28:10 The Power of Simplicity in Business and Coaching

28:57 Crafting Your Signature Offer: The Foundation of Success

30:32 Expanding Your Impact: Courses, Talks, and Beyond

34:17 Monetization and Movement: The Key to Business Growth

42:01 The Importance of Coaching and Advice for Entrepreneurs


Amber Hawley [00:00:01]:
Business owners are increasingly being pulled in so many directions feeling like they aren’t reaching their full potential in business and life despite their type a ways. With my background as a therapist entrepreneur and as a.com dropout with ADHD, I interview and coach high achieving business owners like you who want to stop struggling for success by using psychological systems, strategies and the occasional carefrontation. This is the easily distracted entrepreneur, your place to slay overwhelm perfectionism and shiny object syndrome so that you can get done what matters most to you. Today I’m joined on the podcast by a very special guest. Doctor Liz Lasky is the founder and CEO of the Lasky Institute of Coaching and the coach training program for helping professionals. Doctor Liz is committed to helping people get what they want in business, life and love, and she is the author of the book get what you want. I recently met Doctor Liz and she is amazing. I think you will really enjoy this conversation we have today.

Amber Hawley [00:01:09]:
Today we’re going to be talking about the power of utilizing summits to build your business. And it’s perfect timing because she is hosting a summit called the 2024 Therapist 21 ways to get what you want in business and entrepreneurship. And it starts today. Doctor Liz graciously invited me to be a part of the summit where I talk about using my add framework to get the right things done in your business and to grow without overworking. So sign up today because sessions are only available for 48 hours. And I promise you there are so many great sessions and knowledge bombs. And best of all, it’s free. The link to sign up is in the show notes.

Amber Hawley [00:01:49]:
Or you can go to amberholley.com and sign up there. Hi Liz, welcome to the podcast.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:01:56]:
Hey everyone. Thanks for having me.

Amber Hawley [00:01:58]:
Yes, I’m very excited. Well, I’m really excited because this is a very timely conversation because your summit is coming up. So today we’re going to be talking about the power of having a summit, among some other things, and how you can build your brand and your audience by using summits or utilizing being on summits. But yeah, so yours is coming out. I think it’s like this next week.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:02:24]:
Is by the time that this comes, March 25. Yeah.

Amber Hawley [00:02:27]:
Very exciting.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:02:28]:
Yep. My upcoming summit is called the 2024 therapist 21 ways to get what you want in business and entrepreneurship. And I have put together an incredible cast of characters. You are one of them, as you know. And for everyone listening, if you want to just have a little bit more amber, then come on over to the summit. Introduced and interviewed 21 therapists who are in business and who are in entrepreneurship and in the entrepreneurship conversation. And we’re talking all about how to embody the role of an entrepreneur as we go into this year.

Amber Hawley [00:03:06]:
I love it. And I think, I mean, there’s so much I like about what you’re doing with this particular summit is, I think it is important for us to kind of look at that. Like, how do we embody being an entrepreneur in 2024? Right. Because it’s, it’s just the last few years, so much has changed. And I think, like, sometimes it is about stepping into that business owner hat or that entrepreneurial, like, mindset and hat that it behooves us to take some time to take a look at that. Right.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:03:39]:
Yes. And I. And actually, from this summit, I have noticed and been thinking more and more that there actually is a difference between the business owner and the entrepreneur.

Amber Hawley [00:03:53]:
Oh, absolutely.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:03:53]:
And those two concepts have become more and more clear to me as these interviews have gone on. And I’ll tell you a bit about what I mean by that when I say the business person, many of us who are listening to this, many of us in this world are business owners, small business owners at that. Um, many of us. And I think that this is sort of the secret sauce of our society, is many of us are doing these side gigs, or as we love to call them in pop culture, the side hustles. I don’t love the hustle part, but I’m good for anything on the side. And you know that any of those can really be seen as a business where you’re generating money. And if you’re not generating money, I always joke that you just have a really expensive hobby. You’re doing a lot of things, but you’re not making money.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:04:41]:
So it’s really just a hobby. So if you are income producing on whatever you’re doing, providing services, providing products, then of course you have a business. But just because you have a business, that could mean you’re self employed. It could mean that you’re working. It could mean you’re making money. It doesn’t always mean that you’re an entrepreneur. It doesn’t mean that you have that entrepreneurial spirit, doesn’t mean that you have that. I, you know, the.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:05:04]:
When I think of an entrepreneur, tell me what you think of this, because I think you and I are one in the same. The entrepreneurs are building companies to sell them. The entrepreneurs are thinking ten steps down the line. The entrepreneurs are waking up in the middle of the night having ten ideas a mile a minute, ten ideas for the best friend a mile a minute. The entrepreneur is this person who is generating, who is creating, who is constantly emotion. And there are many business people who are also entrepreneurs. And I’m finding more and more, there are a lot of business people who are not, and they don’t care to be, they really don’t care to be the entrepreneur. And it was a, and I think it’s a really important point of difference for us to acknowledge and to recognize that we’re all, a lot of us and everyone probably listening to this has a pretty healthy side hustle.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:05:52]:
And it doesn’t necessarily mean that you have to be that entrepreneur or that you have to be creating a company to sell it.

Amber Hawley [00:05:58]:
Absolutely. I mean, I think there is a huge distinction to be made. I agree. And like, the people that I work with or even people in my circle, it makes me think about the book e myth revisited, which I think is like, like one of those seminal books that everyone should read as a business owner or entrepreneur where he’s really talking about, you know, the business owner’s propensity to work in their business constantly and they’re not working on their business. Now, as a business owner, you still need to work on your business because otherwise it’s going to impact your profitability, probably your efficiency, and you’re more likely to burn out if you do not, like, address some things. And at the same time, like you’re saying, I think there is, I think there’s like a mindset and an approach to people who I would say, have that entrepreneurial spirit. And it maybe isn’t just about selling a business, but it is about creating something that can stand on its own. Right.

Amber Hawley [00:06:59]:
So even if you’re like, the people that I work with that I feel like are in entrepreneurial space, they’ll still set something up so it could be sold even if they’re not going to sell it. Right? Like, yes. And I think there’s that idea of how can I build something that can run without me, right. And how can I, and I feel like people who are in that space, like you’re saying there’s more innovation and there’s more risk taking, probably that’s happening. Whereas the person who’s like, I want to, I do this thing really well and I love it and I want to build something that makes me money because I love doing this. And then, you know, and that’s where I’m happy. Like, they’re not, there doesn’t, I’m not trying to say they’re not ambitious, but I’m but it’s more like I’m starting.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:07:46]:
To even wonder if we could categorize it as a type of intelligence, because I’ll take me and I’ll take me and my best friend, for example. Best friend Jen. I talk about her all the time. I think the last time you and I spoke, I told you about best friend Jen. So my best friend is an artist. She’s an art therapist. She makes ketubahs, which are the jewish marriage contracts that are often, oftentimes created into pieces of art that you keep for life. She made my ketubah, and it was gorgeous.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:08:18]:
It was totally, like, it was a full on art piece that you would really see in an art show. And everything she makes, she does paper cutting, she does painting. And I’m over here in my horse and pony show, being a therapist, you know, trying to sell coaching services. I have a school of coaching called the Coach training program for helping professionals, where I teach masters level clinicians how to coach. I have year long coaching programs where I’m coaching therapists on their business. And my best friend Jen could be truly running a huge arthouse of jewish art and making Ketubah’s. She does not have the same entrepreneurial drive that I do, for better or worse.

Amber Hawley [00:09:06]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:09:07]:
Now, I would be embarrassed to put a crayon to paper. So you don’t want me to create it? I’m very creative, but I’m not artistic.

Amber Hawley [00:09:14]:
100% same.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:09:16]:
Yeah. She is so artistic, also so creative. But when it comes to things like the drive to make money, the drive to have systems, the drive to talk about marketing, the drive to talk about marketing and sales, the drive to talk about monetization, she is. She is always so supportive of me, but it is never, like, head to head. Let’s think of this. We’re both so jazzed about it. There are times where I’m like, oh, my God, I’m just going to apologize at the thing. I need to rant about sorry in advance.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:09:48]:
And she’s there, and she’s smart, so she knows how to hold it. But we have different types of intelligence around that.

Amber Hawley [00:09:54]:
Mm hmm.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:09:55]:
And it’s. And like I said, there are things that she does that I couldn’t do in any capacity. So I don’t. Don’t at me on it yet. Like, don’t come for me, because if you have ideas, like, I want to know them, because I might be wrong, and I’m open to looking at that, too. But I’m starting to think it’s a certain kind of person. It’s a certain type of intelligence, just like the musician is a certain type of person. The surgeon is a certain type of person.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:10:19]:
The. The gardener is a certain type of intelligence. The entrepreneur is a certain type of person. And I even remember when I was first, when I was starting my first coaching business. And at the time, I had invested a lot of money for the very first time in my young adult career, and I joined a coaching program. It was $10,000. And at the time, that was a huge deal for me. And by the way, I’m always going to be the first person to tell you that invest in coaching immediately.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:10:50]:
You will save so much time, you will save so much everything if you invest in the right coach. So I would do it again and again and again. And I had no cash, by the way, and I decided I was going to get a 0% interest credit card, and I was going to go and I was going to, you know, really, I was taking a chance. It was. It was, ps, long story long. Best decision I ever made for myself. But I remember at the time going and joining this coaching group and starting my business, and I was looking around, and I could not understand why nobody else, not nobody but all my friends, why they didn’t want to create businesses, too. Like, it just didn’t make sense to me.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:11:30]:
I remember my sister being like, oh, my God, what happened here? Did you join Scientology? That all you want to do is, like, get into the 42nd street subway station and try and get everyone to join, you know, how to. How to market a business. And I honestly, in my naivete when I was young, honestly, truly didn’t have an understanding of why not everybody wanted to do this, but not everybody wants to do it now. A lot of people, like I said, own their own business, own your own business. Love that for you. But not everyone wants to be an entrepreneur. Not everyone wants to be in charge of it. Not everyone wants to create at that level.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:12:04]:
I think it’s a beautiful thing, by the way. I think it’s a beautiful thing. But I do notice that there’s a difference, and there’s certainly a difference. You know, I’m a therapist. I’m a clinical social worker. There’s certainly a difference for therapists. As a therapist, we don’t learn the business skills in school that we oftentimes need to build out a private practice. For those of you who are therapists, or perhaps you’re a consumer of therapy, you know what it’s like to go and to be paid, and many of those people are making between $75 to $100,000 a year, and they’re okay with that.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:12:36]:
But then we also see therapists who have group practices with ten people who are making seven figures, who are really expanding and doing digital products and courses and things like this. So I think that it really. It depends on the person. It depends on the person.

Amber Hawley [00:12:53]:
Yeah. I mean, yeah. So I get where you’re going. I think when I first heard you say it, I was thinking something different. And then, like you said, no one’s coming for you. Well, at least I won’t. But I will say, because I do like, that idea of, like, you’re thinking about something, you’re noticing a pattern. Like, talking about it doesn’t mean you’ve cemented it in stone.

Amber Hawley [00:13:12]:
Right? Like, it’s. It’s this, like, process. I do think, like, when you said it’s an intelligence, I’m thinking people who know for themselves, this is what I want. This is what works for me and my lifestyle. Like, this. Like, you know, an artist, like, creating things.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:13:30]:

Amber Hawley [00:13:30]:
And making money and making enough money that they get to live the life they want to live. Like, I think that’s important. That’s a type of intelligence to me, of, like, knowing.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:13:41]:
Knowing yourself.

Amber Hawley [00:13:41]:
Yeah, knowing yourself. Just, like I have said multiple times, like, I built a successful group practice that I sold last year, and I’m like, I never. I had great moments with it, and it was never my passion. I always kind of kept it small because I just, like, smaller than I could have because I just wasn’t into it. I was like, this is not what I love. And now I’ve been able to create, like, the things that I love doing. So I think it is like honoring your own way.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:14:11]:
I do think not everyone wants to be the boss.

Amber Hawley [00:14:14]:
Right, right. I mean, I love. Don’t give me. I love being the boss. Like, that’s my. That was where I was. Like, people would say, well, you can hire contractors. Like, oh, no, I want to tell people what to do because I want them to do it my way, because I believe my way is better.

Amber Hawley [00:14:28]:
That’s all there’s to it. I got it.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:14:29]:
I feel like I fucking know shit.

Amber Hawley [00:14:31]:
And that is why we always had more clients than clinicians. Right? Like, getting clients, because I feel like I understood that part. Like, that part I love. But I do think on the. What the caveat to this is, I do think that entrepreneurial skills can be learned. But you’re right. Like, some people, it might not come as natural, and I guess I say that for a couple of things. Well, one, when you talk about taking out the money on a credit card.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:14:58]:

Amber Hawley [00:14:58]:
I mean, something I have done and I would do because it’s that risk taking. Right. So that’s the risk taking. Hopefully, though, it’s a calculated risk that you’ve, like, vetted the program. You know, you’re making sure, like. But it’s always a risk. Right. Like, that’s.

Amber Hawley [00:15:12]:
And it can be scary, and there’s some people who would never do that, and that’s totally fine. There’s all kinds of risks that people take. Right. Pivoting is a risk. Like, for me, that was a big thing, and that’s what I’m seeing a lot of people with, too, is, like, pivoting from something that’s a known thing that they’ve been making money at, but they want something different. They need something to be different. I guess what I do see, though, is so many of the people that I’ve started working with, they are like, I don’t understand anything about marketing. I don’t.

Amber Hawley [00:15:42]:
Like all of this feels foreign to me. It feels weird to sell, and writing copy for a website is very different. It feels uncomfortable. But as they process and go through it, they actually can grow to become very entrepreneurially minded. But, like you’re saying maybe, is it, like, their. Their core way of being? I think some people, like, they learn it and they get comfortable with it because they may have shut down parts of themselves because of so many things. Like, I’m thinking if you have a high need for security, there are people that I know that are amazing entrepreneurs, but they would never put a course or a coaching program on a credit card because their need for security, financial security, is so high. That doesn’t mean they’re not entrepreneurial.

Amber Hawley [00:16:31]:
Right. So even though I just said that to understand.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:16:35]:
You know what? Let’s take the conversation bigger than this.

Amber Hawley [00:16:38]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:16:38]:
Okay. Because I think that I don’t want to get in the weeds of whether it’s good or bad to be a business owner or not.

Amber Hawley [00:16:44]:
No, that’s why I love that. No, that’s what I was saying is I actually think you’re saying there’s no value judgment. That’s what I thought was really great about it. It’s like knowing yourself.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:16:52]:
I think what I’m taking also from what you’re saying right now, and I think that, and I want to get into sort of what I see in the industry, especially with the people that I coach, there’s a risk either way. There’s a risk whether you take a chance and take out that 0% interest credit card, there’s also a risk to stay still no matter what. No matter which way you go, there’s always a risk. The time’s going to go by anyway. You know, the time is going to go. So we just really have to decide in that moment what’s going to serve us the best. It might be to stay safe. Totally understandable.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:17:28]:
It also might be, okay, let’s take a little bit of calculated, calculated risk. Me personally, in my experience, my risks have always been very calculated. I’m not the type of person who is going to just, I don’t know, give up everything and sell my house and forget my family and all those kinds of things because, oh, this, this sounds like a really good opportunity like that, that, that doesn’t feel comfortable for me there. And there are people who do it. There are people who do those kinds of things. But I think for me, I figured out what feels the best in my own personal integrity and my own professional integrity and my own business integrity. And all of those things, I think, have sort of come through my own experience in business and also as a business coach.

Amber Hawley [00:18:09]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:18:09]:
And the other thing that I, that I, that I was thinking about while we were sort of getting into the weeds of business, pro business owner versus entrepreneur, whatever we were saying, you know, I think the, I think the overarching, more important conversation is really how to stay in motion. How to stay in motion when you are a business owner, how to stay in motion when you need to monetize something. How to stay in motion when you need more clients. How to stay in motion where you want to increase your impact. How to stay in motion when you had a shit day and you’re ready to give up. And, you know, for those of you who, you know, none of you were privy to our little entry conversation before we started this, but today, the day that we are, you know, recording this podcast episode, is not a particularly happy, perfect, shiny day for me in my business. I feel like I’m hitting a little bit of a road bump. And, you know, I think it would be out of integrity for me to be like, oh, everything’s perfect.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:19:09]:
The sun’s always shining over here, and you know what? That’s just not life. And it’s not the life of any entrepreneur. So, so what, you know, I think the point there is really how do we keep emotion? And I think it’s one of the things that we don’t have high enough standards for ourselves on. I think when we want to create whatever it is that we want to create, I think we’re very easy to excuse ourselves when we have a feeling. And by the way, I’m a therapist. I’m a clinical social worker. So I’m all good with a feeling. Like, I love that you feel, and feeling is great, and feel all day long and feel, feel.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:19:52]:
And what I see happen all the time free, is that we feel something and we let it derail us. And so, for example, the moment that I’m in now, where I feel like I’m in a little bit of a. What should we call it? Is it a mindset challenge? Is it a bump in the road? Let’s call it a bump in the road.

Amber Hawley [00:20:07]:
It’s like a little mini funky funk.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:20:09]:
I guess I’m having a little temper tantrum today. Yeah, I’m feeling a little. I feel like a little funk today. And so my choice. My choices are the following, to keep it moving or to give up. I don’t know how long I’m going to give up for. Maybe it’s going to be 50 minutes. Maybe it’s going to be an hour.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:20:28]:
Maybe it’s the rest of my life. I have no idea. Or I could keep things moving, and my choice is going to be keep things moving. It didn’t, it wasn’t always like that. There were many times where I was very happy to give up and very happy to have a temper tantrum and very happy to get attention that way and what’s life and who am I? And all of those good questions we ask when we were in a funk. But I think that. I think the important thing is to keep moving. And I have some very specific ways of ways that people can keep moving in order to expand their business.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:21:05]:
So maybe we could talk about that a little bit.

Amber Hawley [00:21:07]:
Yeah, I think first I want to come back to one just to, like, just so that it’s clear that I was saying I actually loved. Sometimes getting in the weeds is helpful, and here’s why. I think sometimes people need to hear us say things in a certain way for it to connect to them and then be like, oh, yeah. I just didn’t want anyone hearing, like, this was the one way to be some way. I thought, though, what you were saying is we’re not having a value judgment that this way is better or worse. It’s literally about kind of like, how we’re approaching our businesses or thinking about it, because like you said, not everybody.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:21:43]:
I just think that sometimes people think that the be all, end all is the entrepreneur.

Amber Hawley [00:21:48]:
Totally. And that’s not.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:21:49]:
I don’t think that’s the case. Yeah, I’m starting to see that more and more. And that clarification really came from the upcoming summit, the 2024 therapist, because being able to talk to all of these people about business stuff. And by the way, people are making a lot of money. Like, these are not, some people are not making a lot, a lot of money. Some people are, you know, under six figures, but they’re happy and feel like they’re, you know, living a good life, and that’s great. And by the way, there are lots of people who are making lots more.

Amber Hawley [00:22:17]:
Than that, and they don’t feel like they’re given a good life.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:22:18]:
So jokes on who. But there I was very clarifying for me, because you’re right, there isn’t a value judgment. And I think the be an end all should not be that you go for entrepreneur status necessarily. I think there’s room. Absolutely. For both. I know no matter where you are, it’s the same advice. I would have the same advice for anyone.

Amber Hawley [00:22:38]:
Yeah, well, that you need to keep moving or that keep moving.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:22:42]:
And I know exactly how.

Amber Hawley [00:22:44]:
Oh, yeah.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:22:44]:
I know exactly what you should be creating in 2024 to help keep that moving.

Amber Hawley [00:22:48]:
Okay, awesome. And I do want to get to that because I think it’s important. But yeah, I just wanted to be clear. Clear. Because I actually thought that was great. I love that. And that’s what’s so cool about doing something like you’re doing interviewing 21 people. And because you do start to see a pattern when you get to talk to people like that.

Amber Hawley [00:23:03]:
I agree with you on the motion thing, and like you said, it’s not about, it’s not about judging people or being critical, but it is something I notice as well, that some people will let everything derail them and keep them stuck because they’re really attached to that, like, feeling or that they’ve, that thought they’re having about themselves in that funk. They believe it. They’ve taken it in as a belief and it allows them to stay stuck. And I think it is hard because I’ve certainly had those days, like, where I am and sometimes more than days, honestly, like, in the last few years have been hard. But I think, like, over time, the longer you’re in business for me, I would have, I would have my temper tantrums. I would actually, I do a thing I call Armageddon planning. So I literally used to plan out, I have a budget if, and I share a budget template in my. In my memberships.

Amber Hawley [00:23:56]:
And one of them is like army, one is Shtf. Shit hits the fan and the other is Armageddon. So shit hits the fan is bad. Armageddon’s real fucking bad. Right? Like really bad. But I do that because I went through this period of like, when I had the group practice where I was feeling so angry and pissed and resentful and I did that plan and I said, okay, if everything went away, what would I. What would I be left with and how would it work out? And I did the math and I was like, okay, I’m going to keep going as a group practice because I was like, this doesn’t make sense, but I think it’s really good to allow ourselves to be in that funk or to feel the feelings and then sometimes some innovation comes out of it. But yeah, like you’re saying it’s like at a certain point, then you’re like, okay, now done.

Amber Hawley [00:24:42]:
Now what? Now how can I fix this?

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:24:44]:
You know, I mentioned before that I have a school of coaching where I teach master’s level clinicians how to coach. We do it through the international coaching Federation curriculum. So nothing I teach is made up by me. It’s not my own method. It’s not. I lost 100 pounds. I’m teaching everyone else to lose 100 pounds. It’s really evidence based practice.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:25:06]:
And they have this concept in coaching that is called the who and the what. And the what. Write this down if you’re listening, class. Just kidding. I don’t care if you do or not. But I love, I think about this almost every single day. So the what. The what is the mind? The what is the how to.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:25:24]:
The what is the details? The what is what you’re going to do between now and the next week in order for you to organize your kitchen. Right. That’s the what we need to know what the what is. Right. But the other piece is the who. The who is the heart. The who is the whole person. The what? That.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:25:43]:
Remember the list and the details and all of those things. That is the problem. That’s just the problem. The who is the person. The who is asking questions of how do I want to show up in the world? How do I want to take up space? How do I want to show up as a leader? If I was functioning in my highest ideal self, how would I be showing up for myself and those I serve and my family and the community I serve? That’s the who. As therapists specifically. And I can say this because I teach therapists therapists are so good at feelings. We put that in the who category, but we got stuck there, and we stay there because we have comfort sitting in those feelings.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:26:23]:
But you have to have those feelings and the who and those deep questions with the what. It’s a scale.

Amber Hawley [00:26:30]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:26:30]:
The scales of justice with the who and the what. You know, we really have to have both. Otherwise, you’re just doing shit, and it has no meaning. Right. You’re just doing the what. You’re problem solving. But it’s like going to the gym, you know, every day for 45 minutes, and, you know, you weigh 100 pounds, but you still feel disgusting about yourself. Right.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:26:51]:
That’s. That’s, you know, the what. Without any of the who but the who, if we stay there, we’re just a bag of feelings, and we’re not going to get anywhere.

Amber Hawley [00:27:00]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:27:01]:
So we really need to have the. We need to have a relationship with both. We need to be able to have those feelings, but also have the plan, get the. And integrate those two. It’s one of my favorite. My most favorite coaching concepts.

Amber Hawley [00:27:15]:
Yeah. I’ve never heard it said in that way, but I really do like that because.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:27:20]:

Amber Hawley [00:27:21]:
Like, I’ve seen that, but not had that way of articulating it.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:27:25]:
You can class. We got to get you into coaching class, Amber.

Amber Hawley [00:27:30]:
Oh, I think I’m good. I think I’m good. No, I mean, I’m. Hey, I’m a lifelong learner, so I always will. But. But this is the thing about, like, that’s. I mean, I. The way I would probably word it is, like, because I build up these strategic plans and these ways for us to get shit done or to grow our businesses, but we do have to honor the emotional side.

Amber Hawley [00:27:52]:
Right? Like. So, like, you’re saying it has to be both. Like, it’s just different ways of speaking about it, which I think is so great. This is why I know what you just said is going to connect to somebody listening, and that’s going to make sense to them that it hadn’t made sense before. Right? So I love that so much. So, okay, so you’re talking about getting into motion and you’re noticing. I. Now, I.

Amber Hawley [00:28:15]:
Because I didn’t write the word down. I don’t remember if you said it was like, this takeaway that you noticed, like, a pattern with the people you were interviewing or if you just. These are. I know you have these strategies about how to get people going, too. Right?

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:28:29]:
Yeah. I mean, I just have some ideas of the ways that I think people should be in motion for 2024 and beyond. And I think no matter what, whether you’re a therapist or you’re a practitioner, you’re some kind of healer or you’re listening to this or you’re some type of coach, I think that no matter what you are, whether you’re one of those or you’re a dentist or you own a pizza shop, I think that whatever it is, I think you need to have all of these. Maybe not a pizza shop, but the jury’s out on that one. I’ll have to come back. Okay. The first and foremost, number one thing that you need to have, and you cannot go anywhere without it if you don’t have. This, is a clear offer.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:29:05]:
Yes, you must have a clear offer, and I don’t care what it is. It could be a 45 minutes walk around Central park where you look at birds and that’s your offer. It could be, if you’re a therapist, a 50 minutes or a therapy hour where in your modality is CBT. I don’t care what your offer is, but you have to have one signature offer that is so fucking clear. If you do not have this one offer, nothing can be built around it. And what I’m going to tell you is what I call my signature suite. And if you can only build out a signature suite, if you have clarity on offer, so that’s number one, okay? And by the way, let’s not get crazy about what an offer needs to be. I think this is also where people get stuck, that people think, oh, my God, like, how am I going to do it? And how am I going to collect money? What do they need to have and what should I be wearing? And are they going to do it on Zoom and how many this.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:30:05]:
And do they have to walk away with that? Just if you’re a coach, it’s an hour coaching session. That’s your signature offer. That’s it. You can leave it like that. Do not get seduced by these extraneous decisions that are keeping you stuck. Yes, that’s what I mean about being a movement. So number one, you got to pick your signature offer. That’s number one.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:30:26]:
And it has to be so clear, once you have your signature offer, then you can do a couple other things from there. You can build out a signature course. And again, I’m not talking crazy. I’m not talking like, you need to have a full year course. You can have a six module course, right? So give me a topic on, for example, like a typical listener right now. Give me an example of someone who might be listening. Who of their offer. What would an offer be, Amber?

Amber Hawley [00:31:00]:
Let’s see. One that comes up a lot lately is like training the trainer, so to speak. So like they’re disseminating their knowledge, like their particular theory or whatever. Perfect.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:31:12]:
Give me a topic. What would be a topic? DBT. Oh, perfect. DBT. Okay. So let’s say, for example, you have your one signature offer, and your signature offer would be providing services through DBT framework. Okay. That’s your offer.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:31:28]:
Right. And by the way, you’re going to want to, you know, have an ideal client. You’re going to want to do all those things, but we need to know what the offer is first. So that’s number one. Okay?

Amber Hawley [00:31:36]:
Yes. And just real quick, just for those, because I’m doing that notorious thing that therapists do. Dialectical behavior therapy is what DVT is just for anyone else who’s not. Who is not a therapist, who’s listening. So that’s what that is.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:31:50]:
Yeah. And it’s a. It’s a very cool modality that really deals with the presentation. Okay. We love that. So let’s say, for example, you. That’s your. That’s your offer.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:32:02]:
Okay. You offer sessions in that area. That would be your offer. Let’s say you wanted to build a course, but you wanted to teach specifically social workers how to do that. Right. Then you could have a very short. It could be four weeks, it could be six weeks, it could be a 90 minutes. You know, you would want to have create some kind of training, and you would think to yourself, well, what are six things that people would need to know if I were to teach them about DBT? Well, they would need to know who Marsha Lynahan is.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:32:34]:
That’s week one. They would need to know, for example, what distress tolerance is. That’s number two. They would need to know the top diagnoses, where you would use this. You would need to know, you know, you know, four, five and six. Right. There’s your. There’s your six weeks done.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:32:49]:
Now, the other thing, the third thing. So we have your offer. You have your signature course, and the third thing that I think everyone should have is a signature talk. And the reason for that is because if you want to monetize, if you want people to know about your course or your offer, if you want to be able to share a little bit about you and what differentiates you from everybody else, then we need to get your story. People are most compelled to buy something when they hear someone’s story. So we want to get people, I think, into their signature talk. In my year long coaching program, for example, I know for sure everyone has an offer, everyone has a course, and everyone has a story. I even brought in a story coach from here in New York City, someone who is a story writer, who took over for me because she could do it better than me and taught everyone how to write their own signature story.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:33:46]:
Those, I think, are three things that you need to do. Then from there, if you have the time, if you have the passion for it, you can write a book, you can do your email newsletter, you can write a blog, you can do whatever you want from there. But if you want to sell something, then you need to have that talk. So you can show up at that PTA meeting. You could show up at a podcast like this. By the way, do people know you can pitch podcasts, pitch a podcast, people sell your stuff, but you have to be able to say, well, let me tell you about my signature offer. That’s why we want to have those things right out the gate. So when I think about what’s coming up in 2024, for any it type of professional, it’s really having your ducks in a row like that, but staying in motion.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:34:26]:
And once you have that talk, you can be in motion anywhere. At the country club, at bowling, at the. Where? At the hairdresser. Hey, what do you do? Well, let me tell you a little bit. You know, I went to high school here, and what ended up happening was this and that. And now what I do is I really help people get from a to z. Oh, wow. How do you do that? You know what? Why don’t you come in for a session and I can let you know? But all of that really comes from helping yourself really know what your story is and getting that down.

Amber Hawley [00:34:55]:
Absolutely. Well. And the thing I like about what you’re saying is there’s kind of two parts, is like, one, making it simple. Right? And I think we can notoriously, as business owners, like, overcomplicate things. And like I say, like, sometimes we build this box around ourselves and then it, like, it, like, restricts us from moving forward because we’re like, well, I can’t do this until this happens. Like, if this happens, then I can do this. And it’s like, no, no, no, no, you have to do the thing and then, like. And then you can do the other stuff.

Amber Hawley [00:35:26]:
So I love the simplification. And, like you’re saying, I think that process is helping people articulate what they do. And this is where I think so many business owners or entrepreneurs, whatever, they get into this place of, they know their process, they know how to help people. They really can give transformational results, but they don’t know how to talk about how they help people. And that’s the thing. So I like the journey you’re talking about. And I agree. I think that offer or how you’re helping people with what problem is the first part? You need to know that before you can even figure out that ideal client or your branding colors or whatever.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:36:10]:
Oh, my God, the branding color. Can I tell you that when someone is like, I’ve been working on my website, or I need to. I’m making my logo, I’m working on my branding colors. I honestly am like, you need to go somewhere else, Ben. By the way, those are important things. I’m just not your girl for that because I’m rather, come on in. Let’s get quick and dirty. Like, for example, if you sign up for me, with me, to do a year with me, I know you’re going to walk out of there with your signature offer, your signature course, your signature talk, and we write a book in 90 days.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:36:38]:
And the whole time I’m teaching you not only how to implement, but I’m also teaching you how to sell. Because you can create whatever you want, but you have to learn how to monetize that. Yes. So you have to have those ducks in a row, but you really need someone who can help you with monetizing. If. If you don’t know how to do that, it is the absolute non negotiable that you need to have. Otherwise, like I said before, you have a hobby. If you’re not making money from your business, it’s a hobby.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:37:09]:
A very expensive one that you’re losing money at that.

Amber Hawley [00:37:13]:
Yeah. And I think, again, like, I mean, I love all the things. Cause I love to have, like, a polished look. And I love branding. And I came from marketing and operations before becoming a therapist. And like, and I’ve seen people who will never, who keep putting off making it their website. And I think for a similar reason. It’s like, that keeps them from monetizing at scale because it’s like, it’s not easy for people to buy from them.

Amber Hawley [00:37:39]:
Right. But you could have a quick and dirty one page website and make it easy for people to buy from you.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:37:45]:
I have heard of people making, I know people have made six figures from a Google Doc. Let me tell you this. And if you’re listening to this right now and you’re like, all right, Liz, I’m ready to roll. What do I do? This is what I say to everybody. Take this advice every single person could do. You and I should do it, too, Amber. Okay. Make a list of 50 people, 50 ways that you can pitch whatever program you’re pitching.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:38:09]:
Make the list of those 50 people, and your job is to go and tell those 50 people about your service. Now, should you maybe have a one pager or a PDF that you can schlock together in canva, or can you do this with a word? With a Google Doc? Yeah, totally. Do you need a full on website? Absolutely not. Last year. Last summer, I ran a summit. This past summer, I sold $90,000 from a. From a PDF. When we don’t take action in this way, that is when we get stuck and we are colluding with ourselves.

Amber Hawley [00:38:53]:
Right. We’ll see. And this is the thing. You are processed like that, to me, is why. Why that works for you, because you are very sales focused. You have a sales process. Like, you’re saying it’s.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:39:04]:
I’m running a business.

Amber Hawley [00:39:05]:
Right, exactly. So, like. And I say that only because I do know some people who. Again, like, I say, like. Like, really? Unless you’re somebody like you. But again, that’s that entrepreneurial mindset. Right? Like, you’re. That’s just how you’re kind of wired and oriented.

Amber Hawley [00:39:22]:
When you’re not like that, you do need to have, I think.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:39:26]:
Nope. Really? No, I disagree. My entrepreneurial mindset is, I’m building another company. And right now, and I’m in the beginnings of it, I have one company, I’m building another company. The second company I’m building is I’m building it to sell. That’s my entrepreneur spirit. The way that I did that truly is monetizing a product, and that’s it. And that’s what a business is.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:39:48]:
You do not need to have an entrepreneurial spirit to know how to monetize.

Amber Hawley [00:39:53]:
Oh, no, that’s not what I meant. Yeah, sorry.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:39:55]:
That’s not what I meant. I wouldn’t put that in an entrepreneurial category, actually, I think that was just me making a good business decision. Really.

Amber Hawley [00:40:03]:
I guess I’m talking about people who. That’s not what I meant. I meant, like.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:40:07]:
But I have the skills of how to do that.

Amber Hawley [00:40:09]:
Right. Yes. There’s a skill set there. So we’ll take the word. Since we’ve now kind of made that whole entrepreneur business thing, like a thing.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:40:16]:
I’m gonna let you know.

Amber Hawley [00:40:18]:
I was like, we’re gonna put that aside because that’s not what I meant at all. What I’m trying to say is, because I’m gonna stand by this because I do see people who continue to never put their website together and keep talking about, I want to do this and build this, and they don’t have that. They don’t monetize. They’re not out there actively getting leads and talking to people. They don’t have a process. And I’m like, the website for some people, depending on how they’re approaching it, they need that because there needs to be somewhere for people to go to find out what the fuck they’re selling because people don’t know they exist. And what’s happening is I see them in feast and famine because. Because they don’t have.

Amber Hawley [00:40:57]:
You have a consistency that you’re putting in. And that’s what I want to point out to people is, like, if you are consistently doing that right, like, there’s a thing called, like, the dream 100. That’s when you said the 50 people. It makes me think about that you’re putting in that work and that process to have that consistency. If you’re not and you don’t have a website or no way for people to find you, and you’re not putting yourself out there on social or you don’t, you don’t have a list or you’re not doing anything, you will not consistently make money, you will get referrals here and there, but you will be in a cycle of feast and famine. And I guess that’s what I’ve been seeing with people a lot in the last few years. So it’s like, have a foundation. But I agree, don’t let something like a website keep you from growing or selling or doing things.

Amber Hawley [00:41:41]:
But I think in the long term, I just want to make that caveat of if you’re not going to be out there, like, with some kind of process trying to make money and monetize, I think you’re doing yourself a disservice by not, like, having something right.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:41:56]:
The other thing that I just want to say is, and if you’re listening to this and you’re thinking, oh, my God, how do I start? Where do I do? Truthfully, I think get a coach. Like, I know there is a reason why I keep my people. My coaching program is a year long program. I know I can get you somewhere totally different in a year. You know, I. I’m not the biggest proponent of a six week. Let me show you how to do your business. You need time because you need time to feel the feast and famine.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:42:24]:
You need time to feel scared. You need time to have your mindset check with your coach. You need to have someone who’s been doing this before you and there, you know, we underestimate, especially in the therapy world, we underestimate the power of advice.

Amber Hawley [00:42:39]:
Oh, absolutely.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:42:41]:
So not only is it coaching, but it is also get advice. Get advice on how to take movement and how to make those moves. Now, otherwise you will be here for one more year in the exact same spot. And if that’s where you want to stay, we love that for you. God bless it. But if you want to be somewhere else, then it’s time to reach out for help. It really is.

Amber Hawley [00:43:06]:
Yeah, I agree. And I like the. I am going towards that only having the one year option right now. I give, I do six months or a year, but the reality is in less than a year, you just don’t see enough. There’s so many pieces to come together to actually, like, embody those changes, the mindset, the strategies. People get sick, you go on vacation, shit happens, lifes, you know? Like, I agree. Like, it takes time. And that’s something I did, too, from the very beginning.

Amber Hawley [00:43:35]:
I’ve invested in coaches and, like, who I worked with depended on what was the challenge at the time. And so that’s why I like, I mean, I’ve spent a few years with some coaches, and then it’s like, not because they weren’t so wonderful, it’s like I’m looking to address a different issue. Like, I’ve done speaking programs and I’ve done, you know, like, traditional business coaching. I agree. I think it’s like you need those people to help you push your comfort zone. Like, the person that I work with now is somebody who’s pushing my comfort zone of things that I’m like, I don’t like doing that. Like, I don’t. That doesn’t feel comfortable to me.

Amber Hawley [00:44:10]:
But if I don’t push my edge, I’m going to stay in the same place. Right.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:44:15]:

Amber Hawley [00:44:16]:
Like, I love, I love that advice so much. I think it’s really important. And I love, I love that the, the approach of it being really, don’t let there be barriers. Make it simple and just, just fucking do it. Make it clear. Right. Well, I’m exactly, I’m, like, super bummed that we talked about other things in the beginning. I mean, not, not at the, before we started recording is what I meant to say, because now we’re about out of time.

Amber Hawley [00:44:42]:
But I love having this conversation with you. I think it’s good, because I like that we’re challenging, like, each other to think about these things because I do think, like, people hear in different ways because what’s going to hit for them is going to be how somebody says it.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:44:57]:
And you might be listening to us and disagreeing with us, too. And I think that’s totally valid because you know what, and I always say this, I might be wrong.

Amber Hawley [00:45:05]:

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:45:05]:
You know, and I’m open to exploring that. I know I’ve helped a lot of people along the way, but do I have every single piece figured out? No, I don’t think any of us do. So I think I’m open to learning. I think it’s one of the most important pieces of building businesses, too, is always being of a learning mind, myself included. I know you are, too. So I’m glad. I’m glad we could chat like this and push back a little bit.

Amber Hawley [00:45:29]:
I do, too. No, I think it’s good. It gets us thinking. The only bummer is now we didn’t talk about summits, but you could always, I know. I was like, you’ll have to come back, but, and also, you can go ahead and sign up for the summit and actually get to hear you have these conversations with the 21 different entrepreneurs and figure out, like, yeah, see the different ways. And again, that’s the other piece I love is I’m really, I think my thing is, like, really not having value judgments about things in life. And I think for so many neuro spicy people, that’s the problem, is we’re told, like, this isn’t the right way to do something. And it’s like, no, there’s all different kinds of ways.

Amber Hawley [00:46:14]:
Right. And you have to honor your own self. And so I think anything that supports, like, learning that so many people do it differently, I think, is really, I don’t know. I think it’s good overall for everyone.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:46:29]:
Well, thank you so much for having me and for allowing me to share my voice. And it’s been wonderful, and I’d be happy to come back and, and I hope we’ve helped a couple people today.

Amber Hawley [00:46:38]:
Yeah, absolutely. Well, so obviously, we’re going to have all the information about the summit and everything else, but if people wanted to touch base with you, find out more information, what is the best, where’s the best place for them to go?

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:46:51]:
Best place to hang out with me is over at my house@lizlasky.com. L I Z l A s k y I have a fun newsletter that we pump out content and by we, I mean me. I don’t know why I always say we. I’m pumping out content all the time. We also have a great freebie on my website. It’s 101 coaching questions. So if you are a therapist and you want to figure out how to coach or if coaching might be for you, then certainly please reach out and I’d be happy to connect with you. More about that or download the freebie.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:47:21]:
The freebie is really for anyone whether you’re a therapist or not. And we have learn to coach programs and we also have a lot of coaching programs. So come on over, check us out and yeah, wonderful.

Amber Hawley [00:47:33]:
And yes, every all of those links will be in the show notes. I am on your newsletter and I will say I do like it. It’s fun. It’s got your vibe, your fun vibe but really thought provoking. So I appreciate that.

Dr. Liz Lasky [00:47:46]:
Thank you. Thank you so much.


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