How Your Website Impacts Your Professional Reputation featuring Maelisa Hall
We have a special treat because I’m going to talk to Maelisa. We’ve had a lot of interviews. I feel like it’s been a while.
There is more of this to come, but our interviews have been great.
They have been good. However, it is a special treat because we’re going to be talking about why it’s important to have a website and all of those things. For those of you who do not know, Maelisa has a digital marketing company called My Digital Maven. Obviously, it is brilliantly named. She is helping professionals with their websites and SEO. We thought this would be a good thing to talk about and to explore the importance of why we should care about our websites.
Also, why it can help or hinder your professional reputation, which is something I believe. Even if you are an amazing person, if people go to your website and they’re like, “You have this little janky-looking thing that looks like it was built in 1998.” I hadn’t thought of this even before, but right now I’m realizing if there are any potential prejudices that people will have against you, that’s one of those things. If they go to your website, they can either confirm or fight that prejudice. If you are older and you did not grow up in the technology age and someone goes to your website and you have an old-looking website, they feel like you’re out of touch if you’re not great with tech. If you feel like, “I don’t know, they’re young. Do they have any good experience?” Like these 24-year-old life coaches, you’re like, “Can you do that?” Then you go to their website and there’s nothing there. You’re like, “They’re starting out.” You can use it so that people aren’t confirming the biases that they already have.
As you were talking about how it can be reflective of our impact, our professional reputation, it made me think about networking. It’s like saying, “I’m going to go to a networking event. I’m going to wear this T-shirt I’m wearing right now,” which is my favorite t-shirt and I get a lot of positive response. At a professional networking event, I don’t think a lot of people would talk to me. It’s a unicorn with a little blade on its horn that says, “I will cut you.” It’s one of those things where it’s putting your best foot forward. First impressions do mean a lot. We’re not talking about perfection here because people do overlook things. You’ve got to be you. Sometimes I think when people are either scared of it, they feel overwhelmed by their website or you’re getting somebody who doesn’t want to deal with it and it is a lot older, they’re like, “It’s good enough.” They are telling people it doesn’t matter but we disagree.
I’ve heard lots of people saying, “I know someone who has a successful business and doesn’t have a website.” The thing is there are those examples, but when people are pulling those out, they’re usually the exception not the rule. If you’ve had your business for twenty years and you’re a service-based business and you don’t need thousands of clients coming to you in order to make money, then you probably may not need one. Maybe having a one-page may be fine. It is like an online business card. If you’re newer or depending on the type of business you have, you do need a website to help people find you and to connect with people.
It’s an important thing to refresh. For my therapy business, I have gone through three different versions of my website in years.
I’ve only seen two.
In the first version, I did it myself. It was very nice at that time. We’ve got so much positive feedback from clients. It did stand out from a lot of other therapists’ websites in the area.
You were probably one of the few therapists with a website too.
No, I’m in Silicon Valley. Everybody has a website. There were those old school, forever crowd that definitely doesn’t have their website per se, but most people did have a website in Silicon Valley. My website was aesthetically very nice. I obsessed over it for a month. Eventually, after that time, I was like, “I need to update and upgrade this.” I did. At that time, it was very modern and wonderful. In the last couple of years, I was like, “I need to get this redone.” Finally, Maelisa did my website for my company. It’s quite beautiful. It definitely feels more modern. It’s one of those things that you need a little refresher. It’s like updating your headshot. If you’re still using the same headshot from ten years ago, there’s a discrepancy and people are like, “Oh.”
When you meet people, you don’t want them thinking like, “This is her headshot from ten years ago.” I was at a conference last time and someone said, “You’re Maelisa, right?” They came up and introduced themselves. She was like, “It was easy to spot you because you look like your picture on Facebook.” I was like, “Thank goodness.”
When you start getting that, “Oh, wow,” then it’s like, “It is time to update.”
I did think about three main ways that people use their website to vet you. If people don’t know you or if they have just met you or even if someone has referred you to them, oftentimes what most people do first thing is to go to your website, even before they’re going to call. I have been guilty of doing that even when I’ve been referred by a trusted source. If someone tells me, “Use this person,” I still go to their website. People will go there to check out. They want to know what is your level of professionalism to solve the problem they have. They will do this to vet you as either a connection that they want to have, that you as a referral source or vet you like a product or service that they want to buy. Let us dig into each of those three.
Most people will go to your website even before they’re going to call. They basically want to know your level of professionalism to solve the problem they have.
For the first one, they want to connect. Let’s say they want to connect with people in the area, they are networking or maybe someone has referred them to you and said, “You should check out these services.” For example, in both of my businesses, that’s a lot of how I get business. Number one is SEO. That’s how I get business first. People search and find my stuff. Number two is referrals. Other people are saying, “Check out this resource.” When people go on your website, they want to know are you someone that they can connect with. As I said, I was at a conference. After you’ve gone through all the business cards or you’re going through the list of people you wanted to follow up with, l do sometimes go to their website. I’m like, “I talked to them a little bit but I don’t remember what they did.” If you’ve done the thing where you have your creative job title on your business card, people may not remember what it is you do. They’re trying to figure that out. If you just put the creator on the business card, I have no idea what you do. Then they’ll go to your website to easily and quickly remind them, “This is this person. This is what they do. This is the service they provide.” They know whether or not they want to follow up.
That’s a good point because I always do that. I always go to people’s websites, whether I’ve been to an event and I meet all these people or somebody starts talking about somebody or I got a referral or I’m looking for something. I’m always going through because I want to see can I get as much information as possible about this person and what are they offering or what it is to see if it meets my needs as possible before I contact them. Personally, I’m super busy. I don’t want to waste my time having to talk to people if it’s not even a good fit. It’s important because it’s the thing that speaks for us before people contact us. I’m sure there are people that call straight off like when somebody gives a number, but most people are searching and looking at the websites first.
I’ve done this in almost every session I’ve been in. At conferences where someone mentions whatever resource in their presentation and it’s not on their website. They’re referring to somebody else. I was like, “I’ll look it up on my phone quickly so that I remember to check it out later.” If I’m doing that in that context, then I have so much information I’ve gotten from going to different sessions, from meeting different people. That person’s website, if it’s easy to navigate, if it tells me what they do, it communicates it clearly, then I’ll actually engage more. If it doesn’t do any of those things, then I’d be like, “Why did I pull this up again?” Then I move on to the next thing because I came home with 50 different ideas or 50 different resources.
Aesthetically it should look nice, but what kind of information are you including on it and making it so that it feels useful and you want to stay on it. As the web people would say, “It’s sticky.”
Another thing that I mentioned is they might use your website to vet you as a referral source. People want to go to your website, even if they don’t want to buy your service. They want to see are you a good fit for what their clients need. Depending on the type of product or service you have, you can play to that. For example, I know some therapists who rely pretty heavily on pediatrician referrals or doctor referrals. They have a refer a client tab on their website with a form for that person to fill out. That depends on what kind of business you have, but there are different things you can do with your website so that it’s easy for people to refer clients to you.
I was thinking about that and you’re being considered of the copy that’s on your website because that is a big piece of your income stream is through referrals, make sure it’s worded in a way that’s very clear. If they share a page, whether that’s the about page or services, they’re sharing something that makes it clear what people can expect and what you do.
One of the biggest mistakes I made with my first business was I did a little podcasting spree a couple of years ago where I pitched a bunch of people. I was on a few episodes. I did not do the special link thing. In the interview, I didn’t have them go to my homepage. I had them go to my opt-in, which is called a Crash Course. It was like QAPrep.com/crash-course. It was pretty easy for people to remember and easy for them to be able to type in. One of the episodes went live and I had a ton of people buy a specific product from me all on that day and the following day that the interview went live. I’m pretty sure that was not a coincidence. It had to do with being on that person’s podcast, but I don’t have any evidence to show that. Another way you could do that is by giving people a special referral code or coupon code. Think about ways that you can do that. I’m much more conscious of how to use my website. I’ll copy that exact same page and duplicate it, then I’ll put a special welcome message like, “Welcome, my Biz Bestie podcast listeners,” that you’re engaging with them right away.
As you’re saying, it takes a little bit of time but it makes them feel they’re special. You’re taking care of somebody else’s audience and their network. The reason that it’s important to track is so that you know, is this something that’s even worth doing? There are certain times where you’re doing things or collaborations or you do this even with advertising. Even if you’re doing Google AdWords or Facebook ads or Instagram ads or Pinterest, you want to make sure that you have special links that you’re tracking so you can see if this is even effective. That’s another thing like tracking that ROI.
Sometimes you’re surprised for some reason that this person’s audience connects with you. That’s a sign that maybe do more collaborations with them. One thing I could consider is sponsoring that person’s podcast. It gives you more ideas and it’s so much easier because even if I wanted to sponsor her podcast, for example, that’s tapping into a warm market. That might be more effective than paying for a Google ad.
You’ve got to be measuring all of that and it’s important because you never know. Who knew that unicorn lovers were a huge part of our population and we should always be doing unicorn episodes and marketing to unicorn lovers?
Especially in the beginning, your website actually gives you a lot of information about your customers or your potential clients. It is almost guaranteed whatever you do in the beginning is going to change, shift or you’re going to realize like, “I thought people wanted to learn about this, but this thing is the most popular.” If you have your website set up in a way to give you that information, you’re able to communicate and connect with your own audience a lot more easily.
That was even us looking at which episodes were the most popular before we planned out the season and realizing whenever we talked about finances, it seemed like downloads were much higher. It seems like that’s something to be addressed. It’s for us. We purposely sought out people that had that expertise. It’s using the data to make more informed choices so that your website content’s better. The stuff you’re putting out is better and you’re better serving the community that the whole goal was to serve.
On my QA Prep website, looking at all of the analytics and everything, there’s one thing that everybody asks me about in person. Everybody says it is their biggest concern and that’s writing notes. Treatment planning, no one ever tells me, “I want to help with treatment planning,” yet that is all consistently the top term where people are finding me. They’re writing it a million different ways. If I was listening to them, I would not keep creating resources around that. It’s only my website data that tells me, “This is still popular and necessary. People find it helpful.” I keep creating resources around it and it keeps being some of the most popular ones.
As they say, sometimes people don’t even know what they need or what they want. At the moment, notes are for therapists and people have taken notes. That’s one of those things, it’s always top of my mind, “I’m behind. I’ve got to do this.” When you’re in that crux of it, the treatment planning is the thing where it’s like, “I do need a lot of support on this because it’s not something we talked about a lot in school.”
Your website needs to clearly say what you do and what you offer in very concrete terms.
The other reason that people are using your website to vet you is they want to buy what you have. That’s where your website needs to be pretty and easy to navigate, which is as important as pretty, but I think very overlooked. It needs to clearly say what you do and what you offer in very concrete terms. I’m digging into the StoryBrand stuff with Donald Miller. I was listening to an interview with him. He has this whole idea about your branding, how it should be at this story, how your customer is the hero and thinking about the hero’s journey. This all sounds very like, “Somebody’s ideas people that’s fun to dig into.” Over and over again, when he was using examples, he was talking about people’s websites.
It was interesting because I was not expecting him to be talking about websites so much, but he was. He was talking about how your website needs to be super clear. He was using that clear is better than clever. Don’t get creative. Even for his own brand, he’s like, “I thought StoryBrand made sense.” They were doing these StoryBrand workshops. I realized people didn’t know it was a marketing workshop. When they changed the name to the StoryBrand Marketing Workshop, their attendance skyrocketed. He’s in hips. Even him, he wasn’t thinking about that. Does your website clearly identify what you do in ways that people and a ten-year-old kid should be able to understand it?
That’s one of our favorite things. We say clear is better than clever because it’s so true.
I am reminding myself of it.
We appreciate clever. When people are clever, witty people, those are my favorite people in the world. I feel I just met the best person ever because I love that. Not in your marketing, not on your website, wot what I’m trying to be able to read what you’re writing. I think that’s another important tip. Putting in the thought about how easy is it to navigate your site, that’s such a pet peeve for me. I wish I could remember the example, but there have been a few sites I went to. I wish it would stick in my head where they made me work to figure out how to get to the place I wanted to be able to do to buy the thing. This should not be this hard. Luckily, I’m very determined.
I signed up for a summit, which I haven’t done in a while. It was like, “This is the landing page and it’s the clear button.” It says,” Click here to access the site to sign up for the seminar.” I clicked on there, then there was a little pop up that made me click again. I was like, “Why am I having to click again?” It took me to another page where I had to click again. I was like, “This is a free thing. It should be click, put in your email and your name and you’re done.” Unfortunately, that is hard for us to see ourselves. If you have a kid, have your kid do it and see if they can do. It should be that easy. No matter how intellectually advanced your product or service is, navigating the website should be doable by a ten-year-old.
Maybe have your partner do it because kids would be like, “Click again.” I don’t know if they would realize it. For people who are busy, this is irritating. I’ve now clicked four times. I know it’s a first-world problem, but why make it hard? I think that’s great advice though. That’s the thing where everything should be clearly laid out. I hate when I have to hunt for stuff. I was like, “I want to go see their podcast on their website and then you can’t find it.” You called it a blog or something. I was like, “That’s fine.”
Here’s one of my pet peeves too, is I go to their podcast. I check on the recent episodes and it only lists the last six or the last eight. There’s no button on the bottom to go to the older one. I was like, “I have no idea.” I wanted to listen to one from last year. I have no idea how to get there because I don’t know what it’s called.
It’s like, “Do you only have six episodes? “This goes back to, “Are you just starting?”
I think the ten-year-old rule is good for if you want it to be super clear, like more your copy. Is it clear about what you do?
I will tell you my almost ten-year-old, she gives all kinds of feedback about how I wasn’t being clear. They don’t have that ability. Everything’s very concrete at that age. There is no extrapolation happening. I would agree with that one. I was given the feedback that for opt-in forms to no longer ask for the people’s names. I don’t know what you think of that. I’m putting that out there. It’s not like you have to agree or disagree, but they were saying because many people have now caught on to be phony like, “Hey, Amber. Open up.” It almost feels like a disingenuous for people. They said there’s no point for many people. This is true. When I was looking through the opt-ins on my couple’s fix stuff, some people make up fake names anyway.
They only put the first letter.
It’s like gibberish or they leave a blank. It’s like, “Why even ask for it? Get their email.” I like to know everything so there’s a part of me that wants to know it all. Even understanding gender because you can’t. Although sometimes with names, you still can’t assume gender. There’s part of me that wants to know, but at the same time is that useful? I want to put that out there.
That brings up a good point of experimenting. You have to do that with your website. You have to do that continually. I’m still doing that with my website that does well and that is five years old. I’m still experimenting with new things because all this stuff does change. You have to roll with it, but you have to see what works for you. Sometimes you experiment and you’re like, “That didn’t work.” I think about the opt-in thing. That’s one of those common arguments is like, “Do you do the double opt-in where people like to opt-in for your freebie, then they have to go to their email and click confirm? Do you give it to them and add them to your list?” That’s GDPR stuff aside. That’s still something a lot of people have to consider. There are benefits and drawbacks to both. You have to figure out which one works for you.
You can experiment with your website and roll with it, but you have to see what works for you.
Which one aligns with your values and personality and what you think is right? Despite what people think, I don’t think there’s always a definitive right or wrong. The only thing that’s wrong is adding somebody’s name to your list that did not opt-in. Quit trolling LinkedIn people. Quit trolling Facebook. I don’t think our readers do that. We are very ethical people. Our readers, they’re the people being inundated with the jerks that are doing that. That is wrong.
We are as frustrated as you are.
Don’t send me a message. I don’t want to hear it anyway. I digress.
We covered the three main reasons that people would seek out your website. To add a couple of other quick tips, one thing is when you do share your website with people, if for example they’re going to be a great referral source for you, I’ve had this where someone literally says, “I want to share your resources with my group.” This is a general rule for SEO and ads and all that stuff. Most of the time you don’t want to send them to your homepage. This is a common mistake. You want to send people to a special page. Whether it’s a special page where you’re welcoming whoever from whatever group. If you don’t have time to do that, think about a helpful blog you’ve written or helpful podcast episode. If it applies the direct service, but think about something that directly applies to that person’s audience that they want to share.
To go off that further, when people are saying they’ve contacted me and they want direct information about our services, I’ll send them to the service page. Don’t send them to the homepage. Don’t make them go through that. Give them exactly what they’re looking for. I have other therapists that work for me. When I’m referring to them, I send them to the direct link with that person’s bio so that they can get a little bit of information because you want it to be useful.
Along those lines, one of the biggest mistakes people make is not putting key information about your business on every page. It’s because you’re thinking, “Everybody goes to my homepage. They’ll click on my about page. They’ll read about the service.” No, sometimes people go to one page and that’s it. They’re ready to buy or they’re ready to contact you. Information like how to contact you needs to be on every single page that you have. Ideally in your footer. Probably in other places too. That’s your phone number, a contact form, your email address or a click to buy. I see that really often missed. People think, “I already have that on my homepage. I don’t need to have that here on my about page.”
“They can go to the contact page.” Don’t make them do that. Also, when you think about if you google search specific places, you usually see their main pages listed. If you already know what you’re looking for, you’re going to go to that page. To give people a little bit of context is important, I would be thoughtful of how you’re using the top third of that page. That’s the part that they see first. If it’s not engaging or intriguing enough or it’s like, “This is the same crap that you wrote before on another page.”
Do not copy.
This is why I’m wearing a t-shirt. I’m a little saucy but make sure that it’s something specific to that page and it doesn’t look like it’s redundant copy. That way they know and then have that information below. It doesn’t have to be that the top third is the same. I wouldn’t do that. In fact, I think it’s a terrible idea. I think little things like that make a big difference in people staying on your page and feeling like this is useful information.
My last tip is to make sure people can actually find your website. SEO has to be part of it. There is no point in having a gorgeous website that sounds amazing, that nobody can find. Unfortunately, that happens a lot. Google is not trying to trick you. I think a lot of people feel animosity towards Google and they’re not. They’re trying to give for the most part. There are some negative things we could talk about, but for the most part, put yourself in the place of being a client looking for something. Let’s say I’m looking for a pharmacy in the area nearby. Google wants to show me pharmacies nearby so that I keep using Google because then I’m like, “This one is right around the corner.” Whatever I’m typing in, Google wants to give me exactly what I want. You have to tell Google exactly what you have. I like to think of Google as a matching service. You’re putting out your little bio and what you have and other people are putting out what they want and Google is trying to match them. That’s as simple as it is. It doesn’t have to be complicated.
They’re trying to give the most relevant and best information. That’s why there are certain rules about why you don’t plagiarize, why you don’t take people’s information because it dings you. It brings you down in the search. Let’s face it, most people aren’t going past the first page. I do think SEO is a super important one. For me, I have even tried looking up friends or people that I refer to. I type in their name and I can’t find their website and I’m like, “That is unacceptable.” That’s crazy to me where you’re like, “What is going on that I can’t type in your name spelled correctly and your stuff doesn’t come up?”
Do not google search yourself. A lot of people don’t realize that you have to use an Incognito window. Google has learned your behavior. It might give you your website and you’re like, “I’m on the first page of Google,” but only for you. For everybody else, you’re not. Make sure that you’re doing a search that’s not using all the cookies you have on your computer so that Google has no idea who you are and is looking at you as a random person and not identifying behavior.
This is why we have friends. Ask them, “Google me and tell me what comes up. Screenshot it to me.”
I’ve had the same thing where I cannot find this person’s website and I have done their name. I’ve done all these different things. That is a sign that you have probably been dinged. It’s not that you’re not showing up in search, it’s that you probably are being penalized by Google. You’ll have to figure that out so you can handle that problem.
To make sure people can actually find your website, SEO has to be part of it. There is no point in having a gorgeous website that nobody can find.
I know we have a lot of opinions, especially around websites stuff and marketing. If we were to say, “Please stop doing this or pet peeves or this is not good.” Besides the ones we’ve already mentioned, is there anything that you would tell people?
It doesn’t have to be that complicated. A lot of people get into trouble and a lot of these mistakes happen because they’re overcomplicating things. They’re trying too hard. You just have to have your address and phone number in the footer on every single page. Those are easy things that everybody should do unless you’re like me that only have an online business. There are a lot of little things that are really important.
That is my number one pet peeve and I had complained about it all the time. When people only have a contact form, I don’t care if it’s on every page or on the last page or on their contact page, it makes me so angry. I was like, “How many times that has happened where the person didn’t get the contact form?” I had that on my own where we had listed our email address because this is my pet peeve. We had this contact form and all of a sudden it stopped working. I’m not the one getting it. It didn’t occur to me and it went on from September until March. It was bad. The minute we fixed it, we were getting six or seven contact forms a day. It was so bad. You’d need to list your email address. For me personally, I want to be able to follow back up with that email address because often, people get busy, which is a whole separate thing that feels like burnout stuff. People don’t respond and I want to be able to contact them. With the contact form, there’s no way to go back or remember when did I contact them or to get a confirmation. I think it’s an important thing.
I think that’s such a great example because I did not have that on either of my websites. You were saying that and I was like, “I never thought about that.” I totally get that if you want to follow up, you want to have a record of what you sent them and all of that. That’s the best way to do that. I also understand people who don’t want their email being bombarded, which is why you can pay $60 a year and have another email address so that only one email gets bombarded.
If you’re a business owner, why do you care about that? Even if you are on LinkedIn or you’re on Facebook, people find your email address in spam email. That’s pretty private Facebook. You set up spam filters on your email, that’s all. You have to delete a couple of emails a day. That’s fine, but you’re a business. List your email address.
That’s one of the very first things why I started outsourcing. My email got overwhelmed because I started having many people asking me questions. A lot of them were things that I had written a blog post on like, “Here’s the link to the blog.” That was one of the first things I outsource a customer service person to deal with emails. It was one of the best things I ever did.
If that’s your hold-up, consider whether you want to be in business. It makes me nuts. I have somebody else too. Like on ours, we don’t list our individual therapists’ emails on our website. We list only the contact person, which is our intake person. She’s the person I’m paying to get through that stuff. Nobody is spending hours a day doing that. Nobody’s that big. In this day age, we can find it anyway, but you make me work and it’s irritating. I have to go all the way to LinkedIn to find your information.
Since I was getting many emails and questions from people, I did change. There’s the email, but then there’s the contact form. I actually changed it to have a dropdown, like, “I have a question about a product I purchased. I have a question that I want Maelisa to answer.” That flags for me like, “All of those go in a folder.” That’s content for days of questions that people are asking and I can go answer. You want to communicate with your audience. There’ll be so much valuable information. Ultimately, this stuff does not have to be super complicated. You don’t have to have a million web pages. You don’t have to have an insane strategy for SEO. They’re basic things that you can do on your own or things that you could pay someone to do. You don’t have to pay $10,000 too. It doesn’t have to be super expensive either. That would be my advice. Keep it as simple as possible.
Make it simple. Make it clear. Make it easy to buy from you and understand what you do. Thank you so much, Maelisa, for sharing your expertise. If people want to find out more information about your awesome SEO and website services, where would they go?
They would go to MyDigitalMaven.com.
Since we’re talking about the website here, you should head on over to our website, which was also designed by the beautiful Maelisa Hall. It is very easy to navigate. It does have a contact form so you could feel free to contact us there.
We love it if you do.
We would love for you to go ahead and sign up for our email. We promise not to inundate you.
We’ve maybe sent two emails ever.
Spread the love. I hope this helps you think about your website a little bit more. Think about, “How can I make this easier and feel like something that I feel proud that people come to it?” It is not about perfection and saying, “This represents me and my company, my brand and my vision in a great way. It is useful to my customers.” Thank you.
IMPORTANT LINKS:
ABOUT MAELISA HALL
My passion is empowering others and de-stigmatizing mental health care. I’m a creator and an entrepreneur at my core and love supporting other therapists in a variety of ways:
1) Offering continuing education workshops and documentation specific trainings through QA Prep
2) Building websites and teaching therapists about online marketing strategies through My Digital Maven
Amber [00:00:00]:
You're listening to the My Biz Bestie Podcast, where female biz owners find their support system to have their back through the highs and lows of running a business and to make this entrepreneurial journey.
Maelisa Hall [00:00:11]:
Less lonely and a lot more fun.
Amber [00:00:14]:
Here are your hosts, licensed therapists, entrepreneurs, and biz besties, Amber Hawley and Melissa Hall. Welcome to season 5 of the My Biz Bestie Podcast. I'm Amber Hawley.
Maelisa Hall [00:00:28]:
And I'm Melissa Hall.
Amber [00:00:29]:
And today we have a special treat because I'm going to talk to Melissa. Yay! Oh, it feels like it's been a while. We've had a lot of interviews, so I think it really does feel like it's been a while.
Maelisa Hall [00:00:44]:
I know, right? More of these to come. But our interviews have been great.
Amber [00:00:48]:
They have been so good. And however, it is a special treat still because We're going to be talking about why it's important to have a website and kind of all of those things. And for those of you who do not know, Melissa actually has a digital marketing company called My Digital Maven, obviously brilliantly named. I mean, hello, my biz bestie. And she helps professionals with their websites and SEO. And so we thought, oh, this would be such a good thing to talk about and to explore about the importance of why we should care about our websites.
Maelisa Hall [00:01:29]:
Yeah. And why it actually can help or hinder your professional reputation, which is something I believe, even if you are an amazing person, it's like if people go to your website and they're like, oh, you have this janky looking thing that looks like it was built in 1998. You know, it just kind of, I think, you know, I hadn't thought this even like about this before, but right now I'm realizing, I feel like if there are any potential prejudices that people will have against you, that's one of those things where like, then if they go to your website, it can either confirm or fight that prejudice. Right. So If you are older and feel like you did not grow up in the technology age and then someone goes to your website and you have a really old-looking website, then they kind of feel like you're out of touch, right? Like you're not great with tech. Or if you feel like, oh, I don't know, they're really young. Like, do they really have any good experience? You know, like these 24-year-old life coaches, right? You're like, can you really do that? And then you go to their website and then there's like nothing there, you're kind of like, oh, okay, yeah, no, they're just starting out, you know, like a little pat on the head thing, right? You can use it so that people aren't confirming their biases that they already have.
Amber [00:02:48]:
It was funny as you were saying that and talking about like how it can be reflective of our, and impact our professional reputation, it made me think about networking. And it's like saying, okay, I'm going to go to a networking event and I'm going to wear this t-shirt I'm wearing right now. For those of you on the YouTube channel, It's my favorite t-shirt and I get a lot of positive response, but at a professional networking event, I don't think a lot of people would talk to me. It's a unicorn with a little blade on its horn that says, "I will cut you." So it's one of those things where it's like putting your best foot forward. And so it's first impressions really do mean a lot. And we're not talking about perfection here because people do overlook things. You got to be you. But I do think that sometimes I think when people are either scared of it or they feel overwhelmed by their website, or you're getting somebody who's kind of like, they don't want to deal with it. And it's like, it is a lot older and they're like, it's good enough. And then they are like telling people like, it doesn't matter. And it's like, well, actually we disagree.
Maelisa Hall [00:03:54]:
Yeah. Yeah. And I will say, I mean, I've heard lots of people say like, oh, well, I know so-and-so who has a really successful business and doesn't have a website. And And the thing is, there are those examples, but really when people are pulling those out, they're usually the exception, not the rule.
Amber [00:04:09]:
Yeah.
Maelisa Hall [00:04:09]:
Right? So if you've had your business for 20 years and you're a service-based business, so you don't need thousands of clients coming to you in order to make money, then yeah, like you may not need one or just having like a one-page thing may be fine, kind of like an online business card. But if you're newer or depending on the type of business you have, like you really do need a website to help people find you and to connect with people.
Amber [00:04:35]:
Yeah, and I do think it's an important thing to refresh. I think in my— for my therapy business, I have gone through 3 different versions of my website in the 9 years.
Maelisa Hall [00:04:46]:
Oh, I've only seen 2.
Amber [00:04:48]:
Yes, the first version I did myself. It was very nice for the time, and we got so much positive feedback. Because it did stand out from a lot of other therapist websites in the area.
Maelisa Hall [00:04:59]:
And you were probably one of the few therapists with a website too.
Amber [00:05:02]:
No, Silicon Valley, no. Like, yeah, everybody has a website. But well, you're right, there were those like the old school, like forever crowd that definitely they did not have their website per se, but most people did in Silicon Valley. But mine was— it was really aesthetically very nice. I mean, I obsessed over it for like a month. And then eventually after time I was like, okay, I need to update and upgrade this. And I did. And again, at that time it was very modern and wonderful for the time. And then it was like, okay, like the last couple of years I was like, I really need to get this redone. And then finally, actually Melissa did my website for my company last year. It was last year, right?
Maelisa Hall [00:05:46]:
Yeah. Yeah. Like the end of last year.
Amber [00:05:48]:
Yeah, so, and it's quite beautiful. And so it definitely feels more modern. And I think it's one of those things like you need a little refresh. It's like updating your headshot. Mm, yes. If you're still using the same headshot from 10 years ago, I was thinking dystonic, but that's not the word. What's the word? There's like this discrepancy and people are like, yeah.
Maelisa Hall [00:06:10]:
Oh yeah, you don't want people thinking like, oh, Oh, like they meet you and then they're like, oh, this is her headshot from 10 years ago. She looks, you know, I know actually I was just at a conference last weekend and someone said, oh yeah, no, it was really easy to spot you. Like you're Melissa, right? And came up and introduced themselves. And she was like, yeah, it was really easy to spot you because you actually look like your picture on Facebook. And I was like, oh, thank goodness. You know?
Amber [00:06:35]:
Yes, exactly. It's when you start getting that, like, oh wow. Oh, time to update.
Maelisa Hall [00:06:42]:
Yes. Okay. So I did kind of think about like 3 main ways that people kind of use your website to basically vet you, right? So if people don't know you or if they have just met you or even if someone has referred you to them, then oftentimes what most people do is the first thing to do is go to your website even before they're going to call you or whatever. And I have been guilty of doing that. Even when I've been referred by like a really trusted source, you know, like someone tells me, oh yeah, I use this person and I still like go to their website first.
Amber [00:07:15]:
Well, of course.
Maelisa Hall [00:07:16]:
So, you know, people will go there to check out, like basically they want to know what is your level of professionalism to solve whatever problem they have. So they will do this to kind of vet you as either a connection that they want to have, vet you as a referral source, or vet you as a product. That they want to buy or service they want to buy. So kind of digging into each of those 3. So for the first one, if they just want to connect, so let's say they want to connect with people in the area, they're networking, or maybe someone has referred them to you and said, oh, you should check out so-and-so services. For example, in both of my businesses, that's a lot of how I get business. Well, actually, number 1 is SEO. That's how I get business first, but because people search and find my stuff. But number 2 is really like referrals, like other people saying, check out this resource. So when people go on your website, they really want to know, are you someone that they can connect with? And then another thing is even like, I was just at a conference this past weekend, I said, and you remember how like after you're going through all the business cards, or you're going through the list of people you wanted to follow up with. And a lot of what I know I will do sometimes is like go to their website because I'm like, oh, I talked to them a little bit, but I don't really remember what they did, right? And then if you've done the thing where you have your creative job title on your business card, people may not remember what it is you really do if they're trying to figure that out, right? Like, if you just put creator or something, they're like, I have no idea what you do. So then they go to your website and you want it to like easily and quickly remind them, oh yeah, okay, this is this person, this is what they do, this is the service they provide, and then they kind of know whether or not they want to follow up.
Amber [00:09:01]:
Well, I feel like I always do that. I always go to people's websites, whether that's, you know, because I've been to an event, you meet all these people or somebody starts talking about somebody or I've got a referral or I'm looking for something. I'm always going through because I want to see, can I get as much information as possible about this person and what they're offering or what it is to see if it meets my needs as possible before I contact them? Because personally I'm super busy and I don't want to waste my time. Having to talk to people if it's not even a good fit, right?
Maelisa Hall [00:09:32]:
Yeah.
Amber [00:09:32]:
So I think it's so important because it's the thing that speaks for us before people contact us. I'm sure there are people that just call straight off, like somebody gives a number or whatever, but I think most people are searching first, looking at the websites first.
Maelisa Hall [00:09:51]:
Yeah. Yeah. And I think I've done this in almost every session I've been in recently at conferences, like this year where someone mentions whatever resource in their presentation and it's not on their website, they're referring to somebody else. And I'm like, oh, okay. I look it up on my phone really quickly so that I remember to check it out later.
Amber [00:10:11]:
Absolutely.
Maelisa Hall [00:10:12]:
If I'm doing that in that context, then I have so much information I've gotten from going to different sessions, from meeting different people. So that person's website, like if it's easy to navigate, if it's tells me what they do, communicates it really clearly, then I'll actually engage more. And if it doesn't do any of those things, then I'd be like, oh, why did I pull this up again? Or okay, whatever, moving on to the next thing because I just came home with 50 different ideas or 50 different resources, you know?
Amber [00:10:41]:
Absolutely. And so yeah, I think it's one of those things where, I mean, aesthetically it should look nice, right? But then what kind of information are you including on it and making it so that it feels useful and you want to stay on it. As the web people would say, it's sticky.
Maelisa Hall [00:10:58]:
And so another thing that I mentioned is they might use your website to vet you as a referral source, right? So basically, people also want to go to your website even if they don't want to buy your service. They want to see, are you a good fit for what their clients need? So depending on the type of product or service you have, you can actually play to that. So for example, I know some therapists who rely pretty heavily on like pediatrician referrals or doctor referrals. They actually have like a refer a client tab on their website with a form for that person to fill out. So obviously like that depends on, you know, what kind of business you have, but like there are different things you can do with your website so that it's really easy for people to refer clients to you.
Amber [00:11:46]:
I like that. And I guess thinking about that, that's also— you're being considerate of the copy that's on your website, because if you know that that is a big piece of your income stream is through referrals, like making sure it's worded in a way that's very clear. So if they share a page, whether that's the About page or Services or something, but they're sharing something that really makes it really clear what people can expect and what you do.
Maelisa Hall [00:12:11]:
One of the biggest mistakes I made with my first business was I did like a little podcasting spree a couple of years ago where I pitched a bunch of people and was on a few podcasts, right? And I did not do the special link thing. So in the interview, I just basically, I didn't have them go to my homepage. I had them go to my opt-in, which is called a crash course. So it was like qaprep.com/crashcourse. So it was pretty easy for people to remember and easy for them to be able to type in. But then one of the episodes went live and I had a ton of people buy a specific product from me all in like that day and then the following day that the interview went live. And so I'm pretty sure that was not a coincidence and it had to do with being on that person's podcast, but I don't have any evidence to show that, you know, I mean, another way you could do that is by giving people like a special referral code or coupon code or something.
Amber [00:13:08]:
Yeah.
Maelisa Hall [00:13:08]:
But, you know, think about ways that you can do that. So now I'm much more conscious of that to use my website. Like, I will copy that exact same page and just duplicate it and then put like a special welcome message, like, you know, welcome people from the recent conference that I was at, you know, or welcome, you know, my Biz Bestie podcast listeners or something like that. So that you're really like engaging with them right away.
Amber [00:13:32]:
Yeah. Like you're saying, it takes a little bit of time. But it makes them feel like they're special. So you're taking care of somebody else's audience and their network. And then the reason that it's important to track, I mean, is so that, you know, like, is this something that's even worth doing? There's certain times where you're doing things or collaborations or you do this even with advertising. So even if you're doing Google AdWords or Facebook ads or Instagram ads or whatever, Pinterest, You want to make sure that you have special links that you're tracking so you can see, is this even effective? So that's another thing, like tracking that ROI, right?
Maelisa Hall [00:14:10]:
Oh yeah. Because sometimes you're surprised, like for some reason this you person's, know, audience really connects with you. So then that's a sign like, hey, yeah, maybe do more collaborations with them. Or one thing I could consider is like sponsoring that person's podcast. Right. You know, it gives you more ideas and it's so much easier because even if like I wanted to sponsor her podcast, for example, that's like tapping into a really warm market and that might be more effective than paying for a Google ad. Right.
Amber [00:14:40]:
Exactly. Yeah. And you've got to be measuring all of that. And that's really important because you never know, like who knew that unicorn lovers were like a huge part of our population and we should always be doing unicorn episodes and marketing to unicorn lovers. Yes, that's a little homage to the shirt in case you forgot.
Maelisa Hall [00:15:00]:
Since I'm kind of just like thinking of this right now, especially in the beginning, your website actually gives you a lot of information about your customers or your potential clients because almost guaranteed whatever you do in the beginning is going to change or shift, or you're going to realize like Oh, I thought people wanted to learn about this, but this thing is the most popular. And if you have your website set up in a way to give you that information, you're actually able to communicate and connect with your own audience a lot more easily.
Amber [00:15:33]:
Yeah, well, that was like even us looking at which episodes were the most popular before we planned out this season and realizing whenever we talked about finances, it seemed like the downloads were much higher. And so it seems like that's something to be addressing. You know, it's for us, so we purposely sought out people that have that expertise. And so yeah, it's using the data to make more informed choices so that your website content's better, the stuff you're putting out is better, and you're better serving the community that you're— the whole goal was to serve, right?
Maelisa Hall [00:16:08]:
Yeah, and I know like on my QA prep website, looking at all of the analytics and everything, there's like one thing that everybody asks me about in person, and everybody says is their biggest concern, and that's writing notes. But treatment planning, no one ever tells me, oh, I want help with treatment planning. And yet that is consistently the top term where people are finding me, and they're writing it a million different ways, right? So I know, if I was just listening to them, I would not keep creating resources around that. But it's only my website data that really tells me, oh no, okay, this is still really popular and really necessary and people find it helpful. So I keep creating resources around it and they keep being some of the most popular ones.
Amber [00:16:55]:
So I love that. Well, you know, and as they say, sometimes people don't even know what they really need or what they're wanting because in the moment they're— for therapists and people who have to take notes, it's like, that's one of those things that's always top of mind of like, oh, you know, I'm behind or I got to do this. But yes, when you're in that crux of it, the treatment planning is the thing where it's like, oh, actually I do need a lot of support around this because it's not something we talked about a lot in school.
Maelisa Hall [00:17:19]:
Yeah. So the other reason that people are, you know, using your website to vet you is do they want to buy what you have, basically. So that's where, yes, your website needs to be pretty and easy to navigate. Which is just as important as pretty, but I think very overlooked. And it needs to really clearly say what you do, you know, and what you offer in very, very concrete terms. I actually— I'm kind of digging into StoryBrand stuff with— is it Donald Miller, I think is his name, who wrote the book?
Amber [00:17:58]:
That feels familiar. Yeah.
Maelisa Hall [00:18:02]:
And it was funny, I was listening to an interview with him and he has this whole idea about like your branding and how it should be this story and how your customer is the hero and thinking about the hero's journey. And so this all sounds very like, I don't know, somebody as like ideas people, like that's fun to kind of dig into, right?
Amber [00:18:20]:
Yeah.
Maelisa Hall [00:18:21]:
But over and over again, when he was using examples, he was talking about people's websites. And it was really interesting because I was not expecting him to be talking about websites so much, but he was. And he was talking about how like your website needs to be super, super clear. Right. And he was kind of using that clear is better than clever. Like don't get creative. And, and he was saying even for his own brand, he's like, I thought StoryBrand made sense. And they were doing these StoryBrand workshops. And he said, I realized people didn't know it was a marketing workshop. So then they changed the name to StoryBrand Marketing Workshop and their attendance skyrocketed. You know? Sure.
Amber [00:18:58]:
Oh, that's so interesting.
Maelisa Hall [00:18:59]:
Even him, he wasn't thinking about that. So really thinking like, does your website clearly identify what you do? Your 10-year-old should be able to understand it.
Amber [00:19:10]:
Yeah. And that's one of our favorite things, you and I, to say clear is better than clever because it's so true.
Maelisa Hall [00:19:16]:
Because I'm reminding myself of it, right?
Amber [00:19:18]:
Yeah. We appreciate clever. I really— clever, witty people, those are like my favorite people in the world. Then I just feel like I just met the best person ever because I love that. But not in your marketing, not on your website, not when I'm trying to be able to read what you're writing. So yeah, I think that's another really important tip. But yeah, putting in the thought about how easy is it to navigate your site, that's like such a pet peeve for me. And I wish I could remember the example, but lately there's been a few sites I went to, I wish it would stick in my head, where they really made me work to like figure out how to get to the place I wanted. To be able to buy the thing. And it was like, this should not be this hard. But luckily I'm very determined.
Maelisa Hall [00:20:02]:
So I had that happen just yesterday with this. I signed up for a summit, which I haven't done in a while. And it was like, oh, the landing page. And it's like the clear button, like click here to access the site, you know, to sign up for the summit or whatever. Click on there. And then it was like a little pop-up that made me click again. And I was even thinking like, why am I having to click again? Then it took me to another page where I had to click again. I'm like, dude, this is a free thing. It should be like click, put in your email and your name and you're done. You know, unfortunately that kind of stuff is really, really hard for us to see ourselves. So that's where you do have to, like, if you have a kid, perfect, have your kid do it and see if they can do, you know, like it should be that easy no matter how intellectually advanced your product or service is, navigating the website should be doable by a 10-year-old. Yeah.
Amber [00:20:55]:
Maybe have your partner do it because I don't know if kids would be, they would be like, oh, okay, click again. Like, I don't know that they would realize, like, I think for people who are like busy, you're like, this is irritating. I've now clicked 4 times. I know it's a first world problem, but why make it hard? You know? So yeah, I think that's great advice though. And that's the thing where everything should be like clearly laid out. I hate when I have to hunt for stuff or You know, I'm like, oh, I want to go see their podcast on their website. And then you can't find it. They actually called it blog or something. And I'm like, well, that's fine.
Maelisa Hall [00:21:28]:
Or here's one of my pet peeves too, is where I go to their podcast. And it's like recent episodes, and then it only lists like the last 6 or the last 8. And there's no button to go to older. I'm like, I have no idea. Like, I know that I wanted to listen to one from like last year, and I have no idea how to get there because I don't know what it's called.
Amber [00:21:46]:
Exactly. Or do you only have 6 episodes? So this goes back to the, oh, you're just starting.
Maelisa Hall [00:21:52]:
Yeah. And it's like you have no way to know. So yeah, I think the 10-year-old rule is good for like if you want it to be super clear, like more your copy, like is it clear what you do?
Amber [00:22:00]:
For Yeah, sure. Because I will tell you my almost 10-year-old, well, she will, she gives all kinds of feedback about how I wasn't being clear because, because they don't have that ability to like Everything is very concrete at that age. There is no like extrapolation happening. They're just like, no. So I would agree with that one.
Maelisa Hall [00:22:24]:
Yeah, for sure.
Amber [00:22:25]:
Absolutely. This is a little side note, but I was just recently given the feedback that for opt-in forms to no longer ask for the people's names. And I don't know what you think of that. I'm just, I'm putting that out there. It's not like you have to agree or disagree, but They were saying, because so many people have now caught on to that, like, phony, like, hey Amber, open up, or, you know, like, they get it. Almost feels like disingenuous to people. So they said there's really no point. And so many people, and this is true, when I was looking through recent opt-ins on my Couples Fix stuff, like, some people make up fake names anyway.
Maelisa Hall [00:23:01]:
Yeah. Or they just put like the first letter.
Amber [00:23:03]:
Yeah. It's like gibberish or they leave it blank. And so it's like, why even ask for it? Like, get their email, whatever. I mean, there's part of me, cause I like knowing everything. So like there's part of me that wants to know it all, but, or even like understand gender because you can't, although sometimes with names you still can't assume gender. So, but you know, like there's part of me that wants to know, but at the same time, is that really useful? So I just want to put that out there.
Maelisa Hall [00:23:27]:
Yeah. But that brings up a really good point of like experiment. You know, like you have to do that with your website and you have to do that continually. Like I'm still doing that with my website that does really well, that is 5 years old. I'm still experimenting and adding new things. And because all this stuff does change and you have to roll with it, but you have to see what works for you. Sometimes you experiment and you're like, okay, no, that didn't work. I mean, I think about with the opt-in thing, that's like one of those common arguments is like, Do you do the double opt-in where people like opt in for your freebie and then they have to go to their email and click like confirm? Or do you just give it to them and add them to your list? Right. So GDPR stuff aside or whatever that is, that's still something a lot of people have to consider. And it's like there's benefits and drawbacks of both. You just have to figure out which one works for you.
Amber [00:24:18]:
Yeah. Which one aligns with your values and personality and just what you think is right. So, and despite what people think, I don't think there's, always a definitive right or wrong. The only thing that's wrong is adding somebody's name to your list that did not opt in.
Maelisa Hall [00:24:31]:
Agreed.
Amber [00:24:32]:
Quit trolling LinkedIn people. Quit trolling Facebook. gosh. Oh my Although I don't think our listeners do that. So we have very ethical people. So our listeners are— they're the people being inundated with the jerks that are doing that. Yeah, that is just wrong.
Maelisa Hall [00:24:47]:
We are just as frustrated as you are.
Amber [00:24:51]:
And don't send me a message, hey, No, I don't want to hear it. Anyway, I digress, I think. All right.
Maelisa Hall [00:25:00]:
So we covered like the 3 main reasons that people would seek out your website, but then to kind of add a couple of other quick tips. One thing is when you do share your website with people, so like if someone, for example, you know, they're going to be a great referral source to you. And I've had this where someone literally says like, hey, I want to share your resources with my group or whatever. This is kind of a general rule for SEO and ads and all that stuff. But most of the time you actually don't want to send them to your homepage. So this is a really, really common mistake. You want to send people to a special page. So whether it's like we talked about, like that special page where you're welcoming whoever from whatever group, you know, but even if you don't have time to do that, think about a really helpful blog you've written or really helpful podcast episode or if it applies, the direct service. But think about something that really directly applies to that person's audience or whatever it is that they want to share.
Amber [00:25:54]:
Yeah. And to kind of go off that further, when I think about when people are saying they contacted me and they're like, they're wanting direct information about our services, send them to the service page. Don't send them to the homepage. Don't make them go through that. Just give them exactly what they're looking for. Or, you know, I have other therapists that work for me, so when I'm referring to them, I send them to the direct link with that person's bio so that they can get a little bit of information because you want it to be useful.
Maelisa Hall [00:26:22]:
Yeah. And along those lines, one thing I will see, one of the biggest mistakes people make is not putting really key information about your business on every page. And it's because you're thinking, oh, well, everybody goes to my homepage and then they click on my about page and then they read about the service. And no, sometimes people just go to one page. And that's it. And then they're ready to buy or they're ready to contact you or whatever. So information like how to contact you needs to be on every single page that you have, ideally in your footer, and then probably in other places too. So that's like your phone number or a contact form or your email address or a click to buy or whatever. But I see that really, really oftenly missed. And people just think, well, oh, I already have that on my homepage. I don't need to have that here on my about page.
Amber [00:27:09]:
Or like, oh, they can go to the contact page. Well, no, don't make them do that.
Maelisa Hall [00:27:13]:
Yeah.
Amber [00:27:13]:
And also when you think about if you Google search like specific places, you usually see like their main pages listed. And if you already know what you're looking for, you're going to go to that page. So yeah, to give people a little bit of context is important. I would be thoughtful about how you're using the top third of that page. So the part that they see first, because if it's not engaging or intriguing enough, or it's like, oh, this is the same crap that you wrote before on the other page.
Maelisa Hall [00:27:38]:
Yeah, don't copy.
Amber [00:27:39]:
They're going to— yeah, sorry, copy. This is why I'm wearing the t-shirt today. I'm a little saucy, but make sure that it's something specific to that page and it doesn't just look like it's redundant copy. And so that way they know like, oh, okay. And then have that information below. It doesn't have to be that the top third is the same. I wouldn't do that. In fact, I think it's a terrible idea.
Maelisa Hall [00:28:03]:
Yes, yes.
Amber [00:28:04]:
So yeah, I think little things like that. They make a big difference in people staying on your page and feeling like this is useful information.
Maelisa Hall [00:28:12]:
Yeah. And I you think, know, my last tip is just make sure people can actually find your website. So that means like, yeah, SEO has to be part of it. There is no point in having a gorgeous website that sounds amazing that nobody can find. And unfortunately that happens a lot. And Google is not trying to trick you. I think a lot of people feel like animosity towards Google and really they're not. They're trying to give, you know, for the most part, there are some negative things we could talk about, right? But for the most part, put yourself in the place of being like a client or looking for something, right? I don't know, I'm looking for a pharmacy nearby, right? So Google wants to show me pharmacies nearby so that I keep using Google because then I'm like, oh sweet, this one is right around the corner, you know? So whatever I'm typing in, Google wants to give me exactly what I want. So you have to tell Google exactly what you have so that— I like to think of Google as like a matching service. You're putting out there your little bio or whatever and what you have, and then other people are putting out there what they want, and Google is trying to match them. And that's as simple as it is. It doesn't have to be complicated.
Amber [00:29:24]:
They're trying to give the most relevant and best information. And so that's why there's certain rules about, you know, that's why you don't plagiarize.
Maelisa Hall [00:29:33]:
Yes.
Amber [00:29:34]:
Why you don't take people's information because it dings you and brings you down in the, in the search. And let's face it, most people aren't going past the first page. But yeah, I do think the SEO is a super important one because for me, I have even tried looking up friends or people I refer to. I type in their name and I can't find their website. And I'm like, that is unacceptable.
Maelisa Hall [00:29:55]:
Yes.
Amber [00:29:56]:
That's so crazy to me where you're like, what is going on that I can't type in your name spelled correctly and your stuff doesn't come up?
Maelisa Hall [00:30:04]:
And that's where you have to— do not just Google search yourself. A lot of people don't realize, like, you have to use an incognito window. Google has learned your behavior, so it might give you your website and you're like, oh, I'm on the first page of Google, but only for you. For everybody else, you're not. Right. So make sure that you're doing a search that's not like using all the cookies you have on your computer and all that stuff so that Google just has no idea who you are and is looking at you as just a random person and not identifying behavior.
Amber [00:30:34]:
Yeah. And having other people like friends, this is why we have friends, ask them, Google me and tell me what comes up. Screenshot it to me, sister.
Maelisa Hall [00:30:42]:
I want to know because I've had the same thing where other people like, I cannot find this person's website and I have done their name. I've done all these different things. And that is a sign that you have probably been dinged. It's not just that you're not showing up in search, it's that you probably are being penalized by Google.
Amber [00:31:01]:
So for some reason, and you want.
Maelisa Hall [00:31:03]:
To figure that out, figure that out so you can handle that problem.
Amber [00:31:06]:
Yes. So if we're closing up here, I know we have lots of opinions. Yeah, you and I, and especially around website stuff and marketing. So, but if we were to say, okay, are there any like please stop doing this, or pet peeves, or this is really not good, besides the ones we've already mentioned, is there anything that you would tell people?
Maelisa Hall [00:31:32]:
I think my parting words would be that it doesn't have to be that complicated. I think a lot of people get into trouble and a lot of these mistakes happen because they're overcomplicating things. They're trying too hard or You know, like, just have your address and phone number in the footer on every single page, right? Like, that's one of those really easy things, you know, that everybody should do, unless you're like me and only have an online business. But it's a lot of the little things that are really important.
Amber [00:32:03]:
Exactly. So to that one, because that is my number one pet peeve, I know I complain about it all the time, when people only have a contact form. I don't care if it's on every page or on the last page, on their contact page, it makes me So angry. And how many times it has happened where the person didn't get the contact form. And I had that on my own where we of course listed our email address because this is my pet peeve, but we had this contact form and all of a sudden it just stopped working. It was working and then it stopped. And because I'm not the one getting it, it didn't occur to me. And it went on, it went on from September until I feel like March or something. It was bad. And then the minute we fixed it, boom, we were getting like 6 or 7 contact forms a day. I was like, oh my God, it was so bad. But you need to list your email address because I know for me personally, I want to be able to follow back up with that email address because often, you know, people get busy and whatever, which is a whole separate thing that feels like burnout stuff, but whatever. People don't respond. And I want to be able, like with the contact form, there's no way to go back or remember when did I contact them or to get a confirmation. Right. So I just think it's a really important thing.
Maelisa Hall [00:33:11]:
Yeah. And I think that's such a great example. Cause like I did not have that on either of my websites and you were saying that and I was like, oh, I never thought about that. And I totally get that, that if you want to follow up, you want to have like a record of what you sent them and all of that, that's the best way to do that. And I also understand people who don't want their email being bombarded, which is why you can pay like $60 a year and have another email address, then only have one that gets bombarded, you know?
Amber [00:33:39]:
But see, I don't. If you're a business owner, why do you care about that? Like, that doesn't make any sense. Of course you get spam. Everyone gets spam.
Maelisa Hall [00:33:47]:
Because you don't want spam. Everyone.
Amber [00:33:49]:
Even if you are on LinkedIn or you're on Facebook, people find your email address and spam you. Like, and that's pretty private, Facebook. But it's— you set up spam filters on your email. That's all. Oh, and so you have to delete like a couple emails a day. Okay, fine. But you're a business, list your email address.
Maelisa Hall [00:34:07]:
Or like me, like that's one of the very first things I started outsourcing was like my email got really overwhelming because I started just having so many people asking me questions. And a lot of them were things that I had written a blog post on. Here's the link to the blog, you know, that kind of thing. Right. And that was one of the first things I outsourced was a customer service person just to deal with emails. And it was one of the best things I ever did.
Amber [00:34:31]:
Totally. I guess I'm saying if that's your holdup, like, consider whether you want to be in business. Like, it just makes me nuts. And so, because yes, I have somebody else too. Like, on ours, we don't list our individual therapist emails on our website. We list only the contact person, which is our intake person. So she's the person I'm paying to vet through that stuff. And it's like, I mean, really, nobody's spending hours a day doing that. Like, nobody's that big, right? It's just like, oh, come on. 'Cause in this day and age we can find it anyway, but you make me work and it's irritating. I have to go all the way to LinkedIn to find your information.
Maelisa Hall [00:35:06]:
And I will say, I actually, because I was getting so many questions from people, so many emails, then I did change, like there's the email, but then there's the contact form. And I actually changed it to have like a dropdown. Like I have a question about, you know, a product I purchased or something, or I have a question that I want Melissa to answer. And so that flags for me like, oh, okay, all of those go in a folder and boom, that's like content for days of just questions that people are asking that I can go answer, you know? So you want to communicate with your audience, you know, like they're giving you so much valuable information. But, you know, ultimately, like, this stuff does not have to be super complicated. You don't have to have a million web pages. You don't have to have insane strategy for SEO. There are just really basic things that you can do on your own. Or things that you could pay someone to do and not have to pay $10,000 to. It doesn't have to be super expensive either. So that would be my advice. Keep it as simple as possible.
Amber [00:36:09]:
Yes, make it simple, make it clear, make it easy to buy from you and understand what you do. So thank you so much, Melissa, for sharing your expertise today. If people want to find out more information about your awesome SEO and website services, where would they go?
Maelisa Hall [00:36:25]:
They would go to mydigitalmaiden.com.
Amber [00:36:28]:
Awesome. And we will of course put the links in the show notes. And you know, since we're talking website love here, you should head on over to our website, which was also designed by the beautiful Melissa Hall. And it is very easy to navigate, I tell you. It does have a contact form, so you can feel free to contact us there.
Maelisa Hall [00:36:48]:
And people do. And we love it when you do.
Amber [00:36:52]:
And yeah, we would love for you to go ahead and sign up for our email. We promise not to inundate you.
Maelisa Hall [00:36:59]:
Yeah. And we laugh because, um, we've maybe sent like 2 emails ever. So pretty much, yeah, we really will not inundate you.
Amber [00:37:06]:
We will not inundate you. But yeah, we would love it. So spread the love. I hope this helps you think about your website a little bit more and think about how can I make this easier and feel like something that I feel proud of. Like people come to it, again, not about perfection and just saying like, okay, I feel like this represents me and my company and my brand and my vision in a really great way and is useful to my customers.
Maelisa Hall [00:37:36]:
Yeah.
Amber [00:37:36]:
Thank you.
Maelisa Hall [00:37:37]:
Thank you.
