Face Your Fears and Empower Yourself with Mai-kee Tsang

Maelisa Hall [00:00:17]:
Welcome to season 5 of the My Biz Bestie Podcast. I'm Melissa Hall.

Amber [00:00:28]:
And I'm Amber Hawley.

Maelisa Hall [00:00:29]:
And we have a great guest on today. I'm so excited to offer something a little different. I think what will be a very inspirational story for many people. So welcome, Mei Kay Seng. Welcome, Mei Kay.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:00:44]:
Hi, thanks so much for having me here on the Biz Besties podcast. And I feel like I've joined like the sisterhood. So this is gonna be good.

Amber [00:00:52]:
You are part of the sisterhood. I love that.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:00:56]:
I know.

Maelisa Hall [00:00:56]:
Oh, so many ideas already. I'm like, I know, something, you know.

Amber [00:01:02]:
No blood involved.

Maelisa Hall [00:01:05]:
Yes, yes, the virtual system. So McKay is going to share a story about overcoming fear and some really, really cool outcomes. So I'm super pumped. We don't actually know the full story, so we are in as much anticipation as you are right now listening. But McKay, before we jump into that, why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself and your podcast?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:01:29]:
Yes, of course. So hello everyone who is watching or listening to this episode. So my name is Meng Kay Seng and I'm a launch strategist, conversion copywriter, coach, and podcaster. And I love helping purpose-driven entrepreneurs to be able to launch their signature courses with confidence. And so I do everything from the strategy to the copy and just everything in between as well. And I just love doing that. And because it takes a lot of courage and it takes a lot of self-belief in order to do something as powerful as a launch. And so along my own business, yes, I do that with one-on-one clients. But what I've recently started this year is my own podcast. So that is the Quiet Rebels Podcast. And I love the name because it just perfectly describes the people that I serve as well as myself. And you'll probably hear more about my journey as to why I became a quiet rebel. But just in a nutshell, what a quiet rebel is, is somebody who chooses to take a different path and doesn't need to be loud and rambunctious or to be controversial about it. They just want to make a bigger impact. And it doesn't mean that the impact is quiet or anything like that, but they don't make a big deal out of it. They just do their own thing. And those who follow them will just learn along the way. And I just love that way of seeing people, just, you know, little quiet rebellions as they just like break through their own glass ceilings.

Amber [00:02:45]:
I love that name as well. I think, I think it speaks volumes, especially because sometimes it feels like you have to be louder and louder to get heard. And there's just so much noise, as you know, I mean, we all know in the business world. And so that just really Even though I personally am not a quiet person, that speaks a lot to me. So that is awesome. I can't wait for people to go check it out too.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:03:08]:
So thank you.

Maelisa Hall [00:03:09]:
Yeah. And it makes me think of how Seth Godin always tells people, go make a ruckus. Right. But his is, I think, very much that like quiet rebellion type. He's not like loud and out there, but he's not necessarily— he's not hiding either. Right.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:03:23]:
Yes. It's not about hiding. Yes.

Maelisa Hall [00:03:25]:
Yeah.

Amber [00:03:26]:
I love it.

Maelisa Hall [00:03:27]:
Awesome. Well, yeah, why don't you tell us a little bit about, you know, maybe start there with kind of your journey into like what made you want to create a podcast around that concept and that title, right?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:03:38]:
So that title came about because I worked with a branding photographer when I was just starting out in my copywriting business, because up until then I did have a coaching business and actually it just came back full circle. And when I was working with this photographer, she was an expert in branding as well. And so we really dove deep into my own journey, my own story. So I'm not sure I don't know how deep you want to go into this, but I can do cliff notes.

Amber [00:04:02]:
We hashtag all the way.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:04:04]:
Yeah, we went deep. Okay. Yes. Well, it's amazing that both of you are licensed psychotherapists because I actually have a degree in psychology.

Amber [00:04:13]:
You are so part of the sisterhood, I'm telling you. The night owl, multiple multi-passionate business owner, like all of it.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:04:22]:
I made it, guys. In a circle indeed. So when I studied psychology in university, there was a part of me that wanted a different branch of it. So I learned traditional psychology and it didn't quite fit me, but I knew that there was something there that I wanted to go into. And around my second year of university, I actually wound up in an abusive relationship. And that relationship just really showed me how I'd been coasting my entire life. I was the shy girl who never stood up for herself. I was always, you know, I would never speak unless spoken to. And I realized how being that quiet girl, how it kind of led me into that situation. And I'm not saying that, you know, those are prerequisites to being in an abusive relationship, but it just happened to be for me. And that situation just really showed me how I've just been coasting. And it took a lot of courage to come out of that. And it was a pretty dark time during that moment because I was only 19 years old. And I never wanted to feel that way again. I didn't want to feel hopeless anymore. And so I actually took really good care of myself mentally and physically. So I walked to the farmer's market every week, so I got some fresh fruit and vegetables. I worked out like 6 times a week, and that was a bit crazy, but, but you know, I really started to take care of myself. And I started to look more on the humanizing form of psychology. And that's actually through the power of Facebook ads. They found me and they targeted me to be a health coach because I was so into my health at the time. It just merged the two. And I thought, I'm interested in this. So I graduated from university and I just felt the call to do something different. And it was very scary for me. It was a huge fear because I'd been building up my entire life following what my parents wanted for me, you know, to have a degree and to get a job as a psychologist and everything like that. But it just kind of swayed from that curveball. And that's kind of how it all came to be. So about overcoming fear, that is all going to come in. So you can jump in with your questions, ladies, at any time. And so around this time, time of when I became a coach, I fell in love with it because it was just empowering. It was holistic. It wasn't just about the diet. It wasn't just about your past. It was everything altogether. And I just really wanted to leverage that. And so I was one of those traditional coaches who, you know, great at coaching, not so great at sales and marketing. So I struggled as a coach. And so it took me a lot of twists and turns to get to where I am. And here's one of the twists. And one of the biggest twists. So I was in this community of over 10,000 people, and in this community I really admired the leader because the leader, he was so authentic, he was very transparent with his marketing, and you know, he just, he was everything that I wanted to be, and I wanted to learn from him so much. And so he actually ran a challenge. It was a 7 Days of Overcoming Your Fears challenge, and the grand prize, if you will, of whoever made the most impact would get a 1-year mentorship with him. And I was like, I need to do this. And that's when I went all in for all of the spheres. So did you want me to go into detail for each of these spheres?

Amber [00:07:39]:
First off, I just want to acknowledge because, you know, you just— it seemed like it was condensed, but that was a lot that you said because I think that The fact that you chose your own path, and I know the pressures, like as a therapist who works with so many people, the pressures, first off, just from family, like the expectations that here's the path, we're going to go do this and you're going to go in this, you know, this is your route. You're going to go to university, you're going to study this, you're going to get licensed or whatever it is, whatever that path is for somebody. But we hear this a lot, especially, you know, in professional paths, whether it's lawyer, doctor, psychologist, whatever. And I think that alone is really hard to do at a young age, to say like, actually, I don't feel like this is fitting for me. And then on top of that, to be in an abusive relationship. And, you know, again, working with survivors of domestic violence and in abusive relationships, that is really hard to do. So you said it so— it's like casual because I know it's part of your story, but at the same time, that— those are big things. So I think Somebody who can do that and really have that strength and to be able to go your own path, I mean, I think that says a lot in and of itself.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:08:51]:
Thank you. I really appreciate that. And I think it's because I've told the story so many times that it doesn't hurt to talk about it. And, you know, I didn't want to say it as if it wasn't a big deal because it definitely is. For any form of abuse, it's really debilitating. And to kind of like get back into that just for a second, I remember feeling that I was a worthless human being and I felt super helpless and I wasn't worth anything to anyone. That's why it was very easy for my boyfriend at the time to kind of cut off my support network because I didn't feel worthy anymore. And so suddenly all of my close friends and family, I wasn't— I didn't feel like I was allowed to speak to them or to even hang out with my cousin who's a guy. But it was just, it just goes to show how I had, I really lacked self-esteem back then and my my now partner who is with me. We've been together for a very long time, and now I do martial arts so I can physically and psychologically defend myself. And I think for those who haven't experienced martial arts before, I recommend trying it out because for me it's a very empowering way to express yourself, and you physically overcome obstacles because you say to yourself, I can't do something, and then you overcome it right then and there, and it just reinforces your belief in yourself that you are capable of doing more things than you think. And now I'm nearly halfway to earning my black belt in Japanese jiu-jitsu. And it's just a very empowering thing to do. So you can only go up when you're in rock bottom.

Amber [00:10:21]:
So, right. And yeah, and I think one, it's really healthy that I think when we have traumas in our past that we can get to that place where they no longer have that intensity or power over us. So that is a good thing. And I just wanted to come back to it because I think to highlight, because I'm sure there's somebody out there who's in an abusive relationship, or, you know, the other piece of it, the feeling like I'm supposed to go down this expected path, but it's not fitting with who I feel I am. I think both of those things are such big deals. And so I think hearing from somebody who's been through it is just so powerful. And to know, like, you could feel you're at that rock bottom and still be able to get past that. And so thank you for sharing that. Those are very personal, deeply personal things, and I think it's gonna really help people.

Maelisa Hall [00:11:06]:
Yeah, and I think it's good to see many examples of that type of thing, right? Like that type of situation, because we may look at people years after the fact and think that they're such a strong person or they're a leader, this or that, but to recognize that all of us, you know, at different points in our lives can be susceptible to different things, right? So it's wonderful that so many of us grow out of this, but it's It's not that this is only impacting, you know, if we have some stereotype of an uneducated woman who, you know, is in like a fundamental religion, right? This can happen to people who are educated. This can happen to people who are highly capable women. So no one should feel like they're guilty, you know, if or feel badly if that has happened to them. We can all have that at different points in our life and we can all move through it. Wonderful. And I wonder when this challenge came up that you were talking about, you know, with fears and everything, did it take you back to some of those fears? Like, were those things that you felt like at that time you were still kind of working through?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:12:07]:
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Around the time when I took that challenge, it was probably like 3 years after. But I do have to be honest that that wasn't the only form of abuse I've received. And it wasn't— that was just one in a relationship, that there have been times outside of my relationship where that have been attacked outside of that particular relationship, and I think those impacted me a lot more because they're a bit more close to home. And so I think those are a lot more intense as well, a lot more physical. And I've been in the situation, and I just want to say that for anyone who's super sensitive around being physically attacked or abused, you might want to skip this part, but I recall a moment where I was pushed to the floor with my head shoved into the ground, and I was screaming my head off. And I realized no one is coming to save me. And that in itself was a very powerful thought. It could have been very disempowering or very empowering. And I always look at both sides, and it was very disempowering to think, oh my God, no one's actually coming to help me right now. And then that actually set the tone for the rest of my life that I live now, is that, yeah, no one is coming to save me. So, Mei-Kei, you gotta save yourself, girl. Like, you need to be able to fight and stand up for yourself. So that's why, again, Japanese jiu-jitsu— I can physically fight for myself now. And mentally, I've had support from my friends and my family, and I've had professional support as well from other coaches. And, you know, that's just really helped to be able to embrace that moment and to really understand the good things that have come out of it as well as the bad. And so When it comes to being a Quiet Rebel, when it comes to being an entrepreneur, all of it takes courage to stand up for yourself. And that's why I want to really help purpose-driven entrepreneurs, because they want to make a bigger and, and more positive impact on the world. And I know that some of them have probably been through something similar or their own form of abuse in some way. And I want to be able to help them reach past that because they have so much to give.. And I know that I have a lot to give. So if I were to give up, then I'm kind of dropping the baton, if you will, if I'm passing it on to someone. And so in a really roundabout way, I'm extremely thankful for these negative situations because it showed me how capable I can be if I choose to stand up.

Maelisa Hall [00:14:31]:
Yeah.

Amber [00:14:31]:
And, you know, in the therapy world, we know that many people experience trauma. I almost feel like everybody does in some form or another, but it's the people who take those traumatic events and turn them around into something positive for themselves or some kind of empowering thing for themselves that really, really helps them to work past that, to not be stuck in that place. And so when you're— you have such a passion for it because it's coming from this place of, I'm really empowered now to really help people be these quiet rebels and get past this. Again, I think that it's a really hopeful thing, I think, for somebody to hear out there who's maybe not feeling that hopeful right now.

Maelisa Hall [00:15:15]:
And I think it's, it is important for us to acknowledge that a lot of these like deeply personal things that happen at different points in our lives, when you're doing something that in relation to this feels kind of like insignificant, right? Like a launch, you know, like a launch feels insignificant in comparison to this experience. And yet when you're trying to do things like that, that push you out of your comfort zone, those little experiences from your personal life can come up and it's those same thoughts that start to creep into your head, right? Whether it's, you know, a parent who always said the same thing about you and then those are the thoughts you're having about why you can't move past some part of your, you know, in your business. I think it's important to acknowledge that those parts of ourselves impact things in our business, especially when it's requiring us to do something new or something that is challenging us.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:16:05]:
Yeah.

Amber [00:16:05]:
And I just want to go off of that just a little bit because I do, see a lot of like high-achieving women in my therapy business and my coaching business. And I do hear a lot about, oh, this is silly. Like I've been through so much, or, you know, I know other people have been through so much. Like why? It's just a launch or it's just a, you know, a new endeavor or whatever it is. And I'm always like, it's not silly because it does tap into that exact same fear of I'm not good enough, I'm not lovable. And all of those messages you've been hearing all your life if that were the case, right? And so it's still just as powerful. So I agree that I think it's, it's an important thing. So, so you're in this challenge and you say to yourself, okay, I'm going to do this.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:16:52]:
Yes, I am. So the first, to be honest, the first day, maybe day 2, I was completely focused on the prize. I thought, oh my God, I want to win this prize, you know? And so My first fear was self-acceptance. So this is what I did. I turned on Facebook Live, and so I had a full face of makeup on, and I had makeup wipes, and I took off layer by layer as if I was— as kind of like to reflect the layers I was peeling back of my personality too, because there was nothing to hide. So I talked about self-acceptance and my fear that I wasn't being accepted because I wonder, are people seeing me just one way and will they accept the other when they see me past this makeup? And that was a really big deal and I was a lot more reliant on my makeup to help me with my self-esteem. And these days, not so much, thank goodness. But for me, that was a really big deal and I started getting messages from girls in that group telling me how they wish they had the courage to do the same, and I encouraged them to do so. And I found that a couple more people doing livestreams in that group, and they were also taking off their makeup. And it just made me feel so, so happy that because no one else did something like that, you know, a lot of them talked about their fears. And I'm not saying that they didn't overcome it in that day, but I don't think there was anyone who was doing videos like that. In that shape or form. And so that just showed me that my one single action caused a mini ripple effect. And that's when I started to think bigger. So the second day, I quit my day job. What?

Maelisa Hall [00:18:42]:
Dude, this is like it's like a— 24 hours.

Amber [00:18:46]:
You're telling me you ease into things?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:18:48]:
Yeah, I'm kind of like an all-or-nothing kind of girl, so still part of.

Amber [00:18:54]:
The sisterhood, I'm telling you. Yay!

Mei-Kay Seng [00:18:57]:
Still retain my membership. And yeah, so for me, I thought to myself, like, I was kind of thinking about it anyway, and I'm the kind of person who will cling to a safety net if there is one. So I thought to myself, I can't go all into my coaching business if I still had my day job. And I don't recommend doing this if you don't have a backup plan. I mean, I consider myself as quite a scrappy person. So if the S goes down, then I'm like, okay, I gotta fix it. I know that not everybody is able to do that in their lives. Maybe they have kids or mortgage to pay. I didn't at the time, so I didn't have those kind of worries. So I thought, okay, let me go all in. I will figure it out along the way. And that's what I keep saying to myself. I will figure this out. So that's what I did. So day 2, I quit my day job. I filmed it and I was like, hey guys, I quit my job today. And so I did. And that was a huge milestone. I could— I still go back to my old workplace because I worked as a barista, so I can make a kick-ass cappuccino. I really can. And I can do the art on it on a cappuccino. Because normally cappuccinos is like, you know, just the foamed milk with a bit of chocolate sprinkles. But no, no, no. I can make shapes, you know, with that foamed milk and it's beautiful.

Maelisa Hall [00:20:10]:
Oh man, we have so many reasons that we need to like hang out.

Amber [00:20:13]:
I know. Yeah, we'll come visit. I'm totally down for that.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:20:17]:
Yeah, so that was the first 2 days. And those first 2 days after that, that's when I started to look beyond the prize because I saw the impact that it was making on other people in that community because it wasn't just me who was doing this competition, there was quite a few people joining in. So at first, yes, I did want to make a big impact and a big splash, but I didn't— I only like just— I just saw the prize. But then after those 2 days, I was like, no, it's way bigger than that. And then I started to let go of the attachment to the outcome, and I really think that that is what helps to allow me to win the competition. So I can briefly go through the other fears if you'd like me to, or if Deep in? Ready to pen?

Amber [00:20:59]:
Personally, I'm a little curious, like, what comes after that.

Maelisa Hall [00:21:04]:
And just to clarify, like, was it literally supposed to be a different fear every day, or are you— were you— okay, so it was a different one every single time.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:21:11]:
Well, that's how I interpreted the challenge, I suppose. It was 7 days of overcoming your fears. I think everyone else was doing different fears as well, and I thought to myself, which fears would matter? Like, which fears would, you know, why is it important for me to get over this fear? And so that's why I didn't choose ones like a fear fear of of wasps. I mean, like, what good is that gonna help me apart from not having a mini panic attack every time one is nearby? And like, those are just like minute moments in my life. But I thought to myself, no, what do I really need to overcome in order to move forward? So my job was holding me back from going all in. My fear of self-acceptance was preventing me from putting myself out there if I couldn't get over it. And then day 3, I think, was the biggest one out of them all. And so Day 3 was when I spoke about the abuse. And in this group, when you go live, it needs to be approved afterwards. So normally you don't get approval as you're live, normally it's afterwards. But for Day 3, for some reason, the leader approved it as I was crying on this livestream talking about it all. And then suddenly I had a rush of people coming on just to help me through it and just to allow me the space to talk about it. And that was a very, very big day. And because I think around that time it was still quite raw to me, even though it was a couple years after, but I hadn't talked about it in public like that before. So I did. And that was a huge fear of being judged for, or being seen differently. If people saw me as a victim of that, I don't want people to see me as a victim. I want people to see me as a survivor, as a warrior, someone who fought, you know, and I was afraid that suddenly people would think I was weak. So that was my fear and overcame it that day because I got so much love and support from that and I just wanted to keep going. So that was day 3. The next couple ones are not as deep as that, I suppose, because I went pretty deep in the first 3. So day 4 was overcoming the fear of admitting when something goes wrong or when I can't live up to a promise. So basically what happened was I promised to, you know, do a collab with this YouTuber who was quite famous to this particular group. And it turns out that we couldn't make it. But after I made like the public announcements and stuff, I just want to hide under a rock and just like not talk about it, hoping that no one would care, no one would see. And yeah, no, they saw it. So, and so my fear that day was recording a video and I said, hey guys, I messed up. And I'm sorry, you know, that I did. So that was— that's still a big deal. Like, even now, my heart, I was like, oh yeah.

Amber [00:23:56]:
Especially if you're worried that you're gonna let somebody down, you know, it's hard to— it's hard. Like you said, you— that could have easily been forgotten. So absolutely, yeah, that's huge, that personal accountability.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:24:07]:
Yes, 100%. And so that was day 4. Day 5, this was by far my favorite. So day 5 was when I asked a group of guys in gang— and women in corporate suits, you know, quite suited up to dance to Gangnam Style with me and to have it recorded. And I have this evidence, so it was brilliant. And that fear that day was asking a group of people who I didn't have authority over, I asked them to do this really wacky thing And they did, and we had such a great time. One of them really took the spotlight. It was beautiful.

Amber [00:24:49]:
I love that. I love it so much. Like, that's again, it's taking that risk and it's so clever the way you, you know, like the way you're addressing these fears that come up for people. That's great.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:25:02]:
Thank you. So that was Friday. The Saturday I had to talk about the fact that my psychology degree, how it wasn't what it was cracked up to be because I wanted to become a counselor, so I went to university to study psychology, and I hated to admit that I made the wrong choice because not with psychology itself, but the university, because of how it was taught. I wasn't taught about counseling. I was taught— I learned a lot more about animals than I did about humans, so let's just say that.

Maelisa Hall [00:25:33]:
Yeah, that happens in some programs. Yeah, it does.

Amber [00:25:36]:
And I'm really surprised at 18 you didn't make all the right decisions.

Maelisa Hall [00:25:40]:
I know. How did you not know that?

Amber [00:25:42]:
Yeah, I was like, I don't know. On that one. Just saying.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:25:48]:
That was very difficult. The fear there was like, it was kind of like another version of admitting that I was wrong and making the wrong decision at 18. Yes. And final one. So I think this is the first time I've revealed this on a podcast, let alone a video one. So this is actually bringing up the fear again, but I'm going to do it. So My final day, the fear was revealing that I am in a same-sex relationship. And saying that out loud is, oh my god. And I'm not gonna ask to cut this out because this is a legitimate fear. And the reason why I'm a bit— still a bit fearful right now is because I haven't completely shared this online. I haven't shared it with my whole family yet. So that's a big deal.

Amber [00:26:38]:
That is a big deal.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:26:39]:
Yeah, but I gotta tell you that the reason why this was such a big fear was, yes, the prejudice and the stigma, but oh my goodness, the reason why I want to share this is because it really, really, really doesn't matter what everyone else thinks, because when you're with the right person for the right reasons, who treats you with respect, who's kind and brings out the best in you, why wouldn't you want to be in a relationship like that?

Amber [00:27:05]:
Absolutely. And I feel very honored that you would do that. I hate that you have to come out with that. I hate that that's the assumption. I just want to say, but yes, I agree. It's, it's very powerful to own that I'm choosing this amazing relationship that makes me my best version of myself.

Maelisa Hall [00:27:25]:
And I you think, know, one thing through a lot of these fears, these are not necessarily fears that you are like admitting and then overcoming and everything is sunshine and rainbows at the end, right? These are— some of these fears are real, you know, these, these are fears of things that can and often do happen, you know, or things that you have seen happen. So it's not that moving through fear just means, you know, it's not that being the warrior means that you just come out like with a sword above your head, like winning every time, right? Yeah, you know, like, so that I— and yet that is what the true bravery in it is. You know, that is the true courage, is that it's like, I, I am willing to do this and move through this despite the fact that I don't know what will happen, and despite the fact that I know it might still be rough after that, and people may not react the way I want.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:28:18]:
Mm-hmm. Yeah, all of these fears, they are— I wouldn't say all of them have been like overcome with the sword over the head, as you just mentioned, but some of them are a little bit ongoing still, and they creep up every now and then. But, you know, having this public revelation, it helps because it just goes to show that I probably care a lot more than how other people care about this, you know. And so that it's just kind of like a magnifying glass, like the things that we care about, we're up against it as, you know, like a magnifying glass. But if we actually just quickly take that away, we see that the issue is not as big as we think, that we just big it up in our heads because of what it means to us. So yes, it means a lot to me, but I feel proud of the person that I am with, and we are gonna get married and have kids and all that jazz. And I know that I found the love of my life, so I am Oh, not— that's wonderful.

Amber [00:29:09]:
And you're right that that's the thing about fear. It's not that it necessarily even fully goes away ever. It's about like, this is a fear. Every time you face it, or every time you say it again or address it, it becomes less like powerful and less intense, and it becomes easier and easier to be like, Oh yeah, and just like you did in the beginning with your story, it's like you're able to say it and not have it be this, you know, big deal for you because that's something you've already addressed. And so that's, I guess, the message I would want to say to the listeners is that the fear doesn't go away. Like you said, the sword in the sky, it's like some things, yes, that absolutely happens. But there are those things where, you know, as it changes or as it grows, that like new level, old devil kind of thing where it's like, okay, now I'm scared to put myself out there in this way or do it in this particular instance. Or I'm leading this quiet rebellion and that feels kind of scary, but you're still going to do it. And so that's the exciting part. That's where the growth comes, right?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:30:07]:
Yes, 100%.

Maelisa Hall [00:30:09]:
Well, and I'm curious because, well, that one week sounds really intense for me.

Amber [00:30:14]:
I was like, oh my gosh, my hands are sweating. Seriously. I know. I was like, wow.

Maelisa Hall [00:30:21]:
Holy cow. So I would imagine you have to be in a certain place and you have to have a certain either like set of skills or support system around you in order to make that kind of action and to move through that much intensity in such a short time. So can you speak a little bit to what that support system was for you at that time and maybe is now, like how you've built that up? Because I feel like that must be a key part of this.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:30:47]:
To be honest with you, my biggest support system was and still is my partner who helped me to actually come out of that abusive relationship and everything like that. And, you know, she continues to be my biggest rock. So whenever I feel myself swaying or if I don't believe in myself sometimes, you know, she just brings me right back to focus. And she will always remind me of the things that I've overcome in order to get here, because it's very easy for us to forget our successes, to forget our triumphs, because it's kind of like, oh yeah, okay, next. You know, when you take a moment to just acknowledge all of your accomplishments and actually having it somewhere. I mean, I have a folder on my phone and I fill that folder up with really lovely messages that I get from people based on the things that I've said or done or just something like that. They reach out to me and they tell me that because of this one thing that seemed insignificant to me at that point, it was really significant to them. And so that just goes to show that that, you know, what we think is significant may be very different than what other people think. But we are making the impacts much more than we know. And a lot of times you are going to go unrewarded for that because some people just will not have the courage to reach out to you to say thank you. But it doesn't mean that it hasn't happened. So there's going to be like, it's probably gonna be like only 5% you're ever going to know where people actually tell you, they give you reviews, they give you testimonials, all that kind of stuff. But a lot of the time it will go seemingly unrewarded, but trust me, it's happening. And to me, that's enough to keep me going because I also have to visualize the alternative reality that if I gave up on my entrepreneurial venture, that would mean I would be getting a day job. And if you've been to London before, you know how horrific it is to travel at peak time. And that alone is enough to turn me off. It is awful. So yeah, like, it just helps helps to picture the alternative reality and to kind of visualize your current reality and how it can be so much better if you just keep going and just appreciate what you have right then and there.

Maelisa Hall [00:32:53]:
I feel like there are just no words in response, even, you know, it's just like, it's a very beautiful reality to imagine.

Amber [00:33:03]:
Yeah. And I think it's good to have that, that moment too for people to kind of take that in because it's very powerful. Well, It's kind of that quiet— now I really see where you get the name from, that Quiet Rebel thing. It is this quiet, very powerful change that you went through and way of thinking about how you're approaching your life and your business. I think that's really important, especially in this fast-paced world, that we don't take that time to slow it down and just take those moments to savor it.

Maelisa Hall [00:33:35]:
And I think it also really highlights like the power in vulnerability. That idea is becoming a little bit more popular thanks to Brené Brown.

Amber [00:33:44]:
Thanks, Brené.

Maelisa Hall [00:33:47]:
And we don't always think about that, but like I know, for example, the times when I have been most vulnerable with my audience have always been the times when I've gotten the highest response rate and clicks and all of that stuff that you might typically measure, right? But also when I've just got the most people reaching out saying like, thank you so much for saying that, or thank you so much for sharing because I feel like I'm going through the same thing. And whether or not you are in a coaching type business or, you know, like that was not me in a coaching type business at all. So, you know, there's all these other companies that there is a way that you can make an impact through sharing that vulnerability and tapping into, I think, that deep part of people that we all know about and yet don't always talk about. I think that's, it's very, very powerful and it's kind of a new movement in business that I think can have a positive impact across the board.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:34:44]:
Totally agree.

Amber [00:34:45]:
Absolutely. So if people want to find out more information, I mean, obviously I think everyone's going to head on over to the Quiet Rebel podcast.

Maelisa Hall [00:34:55]:
Wait, wait, I want to hear about winning though. I do want to hear about winning.

Amber [00:34:58]:
Oh, okay. That is true. I'm like, well, duh, she already won. Like the prize was just like a cherry on top.

Maelisa Hall [00:35:09]:
But, and I do love how that, yes, like that was your initial motivation. And that's why so often we do things right. Like we have this one motivation and then we realize like, oh, it's about so much more. And I think that's probably why you won because you truly embodied that. It sounds like. I also really love that idea that this challenge, I think you said it was around what, how can you make the most impact?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:35:29]:
The actual challenge itself was overcoming your fears in 7 days. And yes, I did follow that framework, but around 2 days in, I realized because of the impact I was making on this community that it was way bigger than the prize. So I started letting go of the attachment to winning because I was like, I don't want that to be my primary driver anymore. I want to help people regardless and help myself to overcome my fears because I know there are so many people who didn't do that challenge, but they got some form of inspiration or motivation even to overcome a similar fear, if not the same one.

Maelisa Hall [00:36:04]:
So it sounds like you helped other people in that challenge level up a little bit too. Yeah, right, like go a little further than they would have.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:36:12]:
Yes.

Amber [00:36:13]:
Don't address the wasp fear. Don't go poke a bee's nest or something.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:36:18]:
I don't know. No, bees, I will save a bee. I have actually, like, I a had bee in the middle of like a pavement. I would crouch down there and I say to my partner, hey, go get sugar, come back. We're gonna feed this bee sugar water. And it worked, it actually worked. I put a little puddle of sugar, you know, with some water and the little black tongue like licks it and then it started getting its buzz back. So I will save the bees.

Amber [00:36:42]:
You should never poke a bee's nest for that reason. Is there even a hive? I guess it's a hive.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:36:47]:
Yeah, I guess a hive.

Amber [00:36:48]:
Feel like I I'm not saying the right words.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:36:50]:
Yeah, but no, wasps, no.

Amber [00:36:53]:
Agreed, agreed.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:36:57]:
So you want to hear about winning? So what would you like to hear.

Maelisa Hall [00:37:00]:
About how observant So obviously it sounds like yes, at the end of it you, you were feeling good. You were feeling like you won no matter what, right? And that's, yeah, the ideal. And it does sound like truly, you know, winning this mentorship was the cherry on top.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:37:15]:
Yes.

Maelisa Hall [00:37:16]:
Of all of this. But was like, how did that process go? Was there some big And, announcement? you know, kind of how did you feel about that recognition?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:37:25]:
Well, I remember distinctively that behind the scenes he actually told me already that I was going to win. And the reason why he told me beforehand is because he was going to reveal it on a webinar because he was telling his audience that, hey, he's going to run a webinar kind of on this topic, and then he was going to reveal the winner, and that was me. So he already told me anyway, but he actually was going to pick me and somebody else. And he was like, well, you won anyway, by the way, with the mentorship. So he actually was going to announce somebody else on the webinar knowing that I already knew that I won won, so it was a bit confusing. So I was on that live webinar anyway, you know, just to congratulate who else he was going to say, and then I saw my picture on the screen. And the winner is Mei Kae Seng! And I was like, huh? What? So he already told me behind the scenes, but he didn't tell me that he was gonna do that, so it was a legitimate surprise.

Amber [00:38:20]:
He wanted an authentic surprise.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:38:22]:
Yeah, exactly.

Amber [00:38:24]:
He didn't want like, oh yeah, I knew.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:38:28]:
Yeah, so he unmuted me and I was like, oh my God, I can't believe that you've said my name. This was so not what we agreed behind the scenes, but that was how the revelation went. And I mean, earlier at the very beginning of this interview, when you asked me what I do and how I do launch strategy and copywriting, this is how it all started. It was a complete full circle because This mentorship was supposed to be for a year and it only lasted 4 months. And the reason for that is because at the 4-month mark, it turned into an internship. So he actually hired me.

Amber [00:39:03]:
Wow.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:39:04]:
And that's when I learned everything under the sun about how to market, how to sell, how to do it authentically. And, you know, this is how I got my launch experience because we did 13 live launches in 1 year because yes, that is possible. I know, crazy, right? I can barely do one on my own. Yeah, so that was what it was like. And around that time, I picked up a lot of skills. I picked up like one-on-one sales skills, community management, and there was— I even did video animations. So I actually did video animations for him. And some of those videos got over like a million views. I was like, well, clearly, you know, pretty skilled at this. But there was one particular skill that he really highlighted for me. And it was copywriting. And it all happened so fast because at the 1-year mark of us working together, he said to me, you know, Mei Kay, I really feel that you're an entrepreneur, not an intrapreneur. So I really feel that if you were to go all in to your copywriting business, you would be successful.

Amber [00:40:09]:
I love hearing stories like that where Mentors practice what they preach and have this positive mindset and really support you to have your journey be the best it can be. I love that.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:40:24]:
Yeah. And so I left on June 1st, 2018. So that was the start of my copywriting business because I'd been doing coaching years prior. And that's how I wound up here where I am today. And one year later after that, that's when the Quiet Rebels podcast came to be. Because I've really started to understand myself and the people I serve and how my story, how it all relates to quiet rebellion and being courageous and overcoming your fears and just being brave. So that is a story of me for now.

Amber [00:41:00]:
Fantastic. Thus far.

Maelisa Hall [00:41:02]:
Yes, it's like the story of the beginning, right?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:41:05]:
Exactly.

Amber [00:41:09]:
Obviously people are going to go check out the Quiet Rebel Podcast, as we said, and if they were interested in finding out more about you or contacting you for obviously these epic copywriting skills, where would they go?

Mei-Kay Seng [00:41:24]:
You can go to meikashang.com. I'll send you guys a link because I know that my name is not that common.

Amber [00:41:30]:
Yes, we will link in the show notes. Show notes.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:41:34]:
Show notes. Yeah, and on my website you'll be able to see the different services that I offer. So there are obviously launch services for custom launch, express services, and one of my new favorites is my podcast pitching service. So now that's something that I'm super passionate about, of getting more people's voices out there on podcasts that will truly value their expertise and just to build their authority and just, you know, allow them to have visibility that they deserve in order for their business to thrive. So those are my 3 core services, and you'll find my podcast there, of course, The Quiet Rebels Podcast, and my best social media platform you'll see me on is Instagram. So all of that, all of those links, you'll see them on my website. So it's just one URL. So you can just click on through and see what you like.

Amber [00:42:21]:
Fantastic. And again, thank you so much for being so vulnerable and so open. I know that even if you do it a lot, it still is hard. It's a hard thing to do. And, but I know the value of your story and that being vulnerable is going to be for our listeners. And I'm sure you're going to touch more than one of them.. And it's going to be a very helpful episode. I think this is going to be a really fantastic episode for people.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:42:47]:
Thank you. I honestly, I really hope that there's just one shift or one nugget of wisdom or something that every single listener who's listening right now is able to take away today. So that is all I hope for. And I hope that my story was entertaining. This is great because I know that it's around an hour or so, I think, for And so I hope that was worth listening to.

Amber [00:43:12]:
It absolutely was. And I actually thinking about that, I would love to hear from our listeners. I would love to hear from you and tell us, is there a fear that's holding you back that you're willing to take a risk or address? And we would love to hear it, whether you share it with us on social media or head on over to our website and leave a comment there and let us know. We would love to follow along and hear about the people who are going to take that risk and address that fear. After being inspired by your story.

Mei-Kay Seng [00:43:39]:
Yeah, I would love to be able to hear any fears that they have discovered and that they want to conquer in order to move forward, because honestly, staying in your fear is only going to keep you stuck. And you— I think it helps to understand why your fear is there in the first place. And I'm sure both of you have worked with people on this. And you know what I find really helpful is like physically embracing yourself. So for those who are watching this as a video, literally hug yourself and give yourself the love that you deserve, because your fear comes from a place of protection. And I think that's really important to acknowledge, that every single fear you have, there's some form of protection here. So just thank your body and thank your mind for looking out for you. And when you acknowledge that, the vice grip kind of loses its hold on you a bit, where you can break through and, you know, overcome it.

Amber [00:44:33]:
Thank you. Thank you.